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Post by FairyGodmother on Jun 9, 2022 12:01:31 GMT
Now if it was the first non-binary Phantom, or the first trans Jean Valjean, then yeah, 100% I can see the "making history" aspect... but Legally Blonde... calm down. How would you know though — the Phantom is a male character. If I can tell the actor is non-binary when I'm watching, then that means they're not acting well enough! Edited to add: I've just realised it would say in the programme. I still wouldn't want to know by watching though! |
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Post by ladidah on Jun 9, 2022 12:01:45 GMT
Yes, Allie. I really love her.
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Post by southstreet on Jun 9, 2022 12:06:10 GMT
They said they have lost their voice, so would think just a normal day off sick. :-)
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Post by ladidah on Jun 9, 2022 12:12:51 GMT
This is going to sound nasty, but they did sound very off last night. The songs just need to be amended slightly so they key is right for them.
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Post by cezbear on Jun 9, 2022 12:14:47 GMT
They sound off every night. It'll be very interesting to hear how Allie compares.
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Post by stagebyte on Jun 9, 2022 12:23:40 GMT
This is going to sound nasty, but they did sound very off last night. The songs just need to be amended slightly so they key is right for them. The show was written in the key needed for the role of Margot. It’s not as simple as just adjusting a key for one person. They need to cast someone (non binary/trans whatever) who can sing it |
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Post by stagebyte on Jun 9, 2022 12:26:44 GMT
Now if it was the first non-binary Phantom, or the first trans Jean Valjean, then yeah, 100% I can see the "making history" aspect... but Legally Blonde... calm down. How would you know though — the Phantom is a male character. If I can tell the actor is non-binary when I'm watching, then that means they're not acting well enough! Edited to add: I've just realised it would say in the programme. I still wouldn't want to know by watching though! Well this is the thing isn’t it. What relevance is it to know the actor is non binary? I literally don’t give a monkeys what anyone does off stage as long as they can play the role it’s details I don’t need, |
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Post by FairyGodmother on Jun 9, 2022 12:43:26 GMT
This is going to sound nasty, but they did sound very off last night. The songs just need to be amended slightly so they key is right for them. The show was written in the key needed for the role of Margot. It’s not as simple as just adjusting a key for one person. They need to cast someone (non binary/trans whatever) who can sing it I think you will struggle to get anybody trans/non-binary who can sing it as it was designed to sound — at least not somebody who's had a male puberty. I looked at the casting notes and they want an F5. With a post-puberty larynx that's going to be falsetto (ok, there will be some tenors/countertenors who could do it) and it won't sound like it would in a female voice. (I'm also unconvinced you'd get a trans Valjean — even if you're a trained alto, could you become a dramatic tenor? I suppose Valjeans are usually older so you'd have more time to work on it.) |
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Post by stagebyte on Jun 9, 2022 12:50:07 GMT
The show was written in the key needed for the role of Margot. It’s not as simple as just adjusting a key for one person. They need to cast someone (non binary/trans whatever) who can sing it I think you will struggle to get anybody trans/non-binary who can sing it as it was designed to sound — at least not somebody who's had a male puberty. I looked at the casting notes and they want an F5. With a post-puberty larynx that's going to be falsetto (ok, there will be some tenors/countertenors who could do it) and it won't sound like it would in a female voice. (I'm also unconvinced you'd get a trans Valjean — even if you're a trained alto, could you become a dramatic tenor? I suppose Valjeans are usually older so you'd have more time to work on it.) Well exactly. Maybe Margot was not the part to choose to ‘make history’ by showcasing a trans performer? I think when casting any MT role the role should be able to be sung correctly at the bare minimum. It’s not enough to trail blaze if you then go on to expose the performers unsuitability. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2022 13:00:33 GMT
I know I'm going to sound really bitter here, but I've seen a few posts from cast members saying things like "I have made history tonight by being the first trans/non-binary/whatever else X in history." I can't help but feel it's Legally Blonde... is it really making history? Now if it was the first non-binary Phantom, or the first trans Jean Valjean, then yeah, 100% I can see the "making history" aspect... but Legally Blonde... calm down. The Phantom is so made up it would be of no interest what the gender or self identity they had. The first one had one as he was a Frank. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2022 13:05:47 GMT
As regards Isaac there are a lot of roles that would be suitable and I'd think he'd be good at but Margot doesn't seem the right fit.
I was joking about CHF in LB given all her social media stuff and that cast's too but in some ways as a performer with a big fanbase she would make sense. They have cast Courtney who is a curvier lady so why not CHF.
If they had wanted to spin something why not make Callahan female and have her as a total bitch - powerdressing and hitting on Elle?
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Post by stagebyte on Jun 9, 2022 14:02:05 GMT
As regards Isaac there are a lot of roles that would be suitable and I'd think he'd be good at but Margot doesn't seem the right fit. I was joking about CHF in LB given all her social media stuff and that cast's too but in some ways as a performer with a big fanbase she would make sense. They have cast Courtney who is a curvier lady so why not CHF. If they had wanted to spin something why not make Callahan female and have her as a total bitch - powerdressing and hitting on Elle? I’m sure they would consider CHF far too old for Elle at 30 this year. Isn’t that the year when we’re all supposed to go live on the Island of Irrelevance for ‘old people’? 😉 I guess there’s already one show ‘bitch’ in Vivienne so maybe Callahan would be one bitch too far? |
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Post by ladidah on Jun 9, 2022 14:24:11 GMT
I think Callahan's role is just fine, I don't really miss the other professor from the film.
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Post by partytentdown on Jun 9, 2022 17:04:55 GMT
Does anyone have a list of the lyric changes?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2022 18:00:27 GMT
Sheridan played the role at 29 and Courtney is 27 so CHF appraching 30 is same ballpark. But I get the age joke although if this cast was in Logan's run they would probably worry more about gender neutral portaloos
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Post by inthenose on Jun 9, 2022 18:27:20 GMT
Sheridan played the role at 29 and Courtney is 27 so CHF appraching 30 is same ballpark. But I get the age joke although if this cast was in Logan's run they would probably worry more about gender neutral portaloos Of all the complaints, praise and inbetween in any thread, we need more Logan's Run references! |
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Post by anthony on Jun 9, 2022 21:15:27 GMT
Does anyone have a list of the lyric changes? There were quite a few throughout - most relating to the changes in terms of technological advances (for example, Elle emails her CV so the "It's scented" line has changed, but I can't recall what to.) Callahan no longer sings "and he can get you high and laid" during Blood in the Water, which I see as the biggest problem. The programme references Weinstein, but isn't the whole point similar? Callahan uses his position of power to take advantage of young women... I don't get why they changed it - it surely actually goes AGAINST what they were trying to achieve? |
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Post by starlight92 on Jun 9, 2022 21:26:29 GMT
Does anyone have a list of the lyric changes? There were quite a few throughout - most relating to the changes in terms of technological advances (for example, Elle emails her CV so the "It's scented" line has changed, but I can't recall what to.) Callahan no longer sings "and he can get you high and laid" during Blood in the Water, which I see as the biggest problem. The programme references Weinstein, but isn't the whole point similar? Callahan uses his position of power to take advantage of young women... I don't get why they changed it - it surely actually goes AGAINST what they were trying to achieve? With the CV, Callahan now says "Dear god, it's interactive", which is not as funny as it being scented in my opinion! Also one lyric change I found a bit clunky was in Positive, instead of "Try not to get upset, it's time for me to go brunette" she says "And you might want to sit down, gotta dye my hair a mousy brown". I don't see what was wrong with the old line either! Also I think earlier in Positive they changed the "Violence is never wise, not the way to win back guys, anyway she's twice my size" lines, I can't remember what to though, something about her believing in sisterhood. |
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Post by stagebyte on Jun 9, 2022 21:38:23 GMT
There were quite a few throughout - most relating to the changes in terms of technological advances (for example, Elle emails her CV so the "It's scented" line has changed, but I can't recall what to.) Callahan no longer sings "and he can get you high and laid" during Blood in the Water, which I see as the biggest problem. The programme references Weinstein, but isn't the whole point similar? Callahan uses his position of power to take advantage of young women... I don't get why they changed it - it surely actually goes AGAINST what they were trying to achieve? With the CV, Callahan now says "Dear god, it's interactive", which is not as funny as it being scented in my opinion! Also one lyric change I found a bit clunky was in Positive, instead of "Try not to get upset, it's time for me to go brunette" she says "And you might want to sit down, gotta dye my hair a mousy brown". I don't see what was wrong with the old line either! Also I think earlier in Positive they changed the "Violence is never wise, not the way to win back guys, anyway she's twice my size" lines, I can't remember what to though, something about her believing in sisterhood. Interactive just isn’t funny. The scented line always got a laugh. Why change brunette to mousy brown? And yes the whole point of Callahan is that he’s a massive greaseball who abuses his position. The writers must’ve signed off the changes officially though so they must’ve thought they were ok. But at what point do changes change the integrity of the original? For the sake of ‘updating’ it. What’s wrong with it being set in the original time frame? It’s almost like they don’t trust the ‘youngsters’ they’re attracting to be engaged. But good performances should’ve been enough? |
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Post by cezbear on Jun 9, 2022 22:21:24 GMT
In Positive it's now:
'Violence is never good. I believe in sisterhood.'
Serena: 'Hit her with a piece of wood?'
Which works fine, and obviously had to be changed since the twice my size lyric would no longer work.
Saw Allie today as Margot and much preferred to Isaac. It still doesn't sit right for her voice and in places still didn't sound good but she does work with it better I thought.
On my return visit my thoughts haven't massively changed from before. It's all a bit tacky and cheap and the dogs are beyond embarrassing but there are some lovely performances in there. Michael's Emmett is still the heart of the show for me but Nadine's Paulette threatens to steal it. I'd love to see them in a better production.
I have to give Courtney credit also, I was not enthused by her casting but she really is a lovely Elle with great comic timing.
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Post by LaLuPone on Jun 9, 2022 22:38:14 GMT
Another lyric change in Blood in the Water: Callahan used to say “oh you lesbians think you’re so tough!” And now it’s just “oh you feminists think you’re so tough!”
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Post by ladidah on Jun 10, 2022 6:58:14 GMT
Yes, just some small lyric changes. Only because I love the show I realised something was different but I usually couldn't spot what had changed.
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Post by leanne23 on Jun 10, 2022 7:46:03 GMT
Is the 2hr 20 min run time correct? I’d like to go to the matinee on June 23rd which starts at 2.15 but I have a meal booked at Oxford Circus at 5.30. I should make it, right? It’s one stop on the Bakerloo line.
Likewise, do they release £15 seats for every show. Wondering if I should hold out until the day to book seats?
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Post by JJShaw on Jun 10, 2022 7:46:31 GMT
"And you might want to sit down, gotta dye my hair a mousy brown" sounds like a cheap lyric that should only be a placeholder until the second rewrite comes in, its clunky. The original line is so good, why would you need to change this? Do they not think British people know the word brunette?
My only other thought is, since they took out the line about Elle "denying her highlights" is it to get around that Elle already dyes her hair blonde, so "going brunette" wouldn't be enough of a change (if that was already her natural hair colour) so to emphasise how for her being brunette is downplaying her hotness they added mousy? I'm sure I'm overthinking!
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Post by ladidah on Jun 10, 2022 7:51:55 GMT
I don't see a lot of cheaper seats now the show is popular and it's a short run. Most seem to be 40-50 min.
The run time is hard to predict as the times I've been its rained, or the show started late because the bar/toilets were packed.
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