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Post by intoanewlife on Jun 7, 2022 0:24:02 GMT
The original cast is in it because no one else will ever compare to the magic they created together.
They owned their roles in ways no one has since and deserve to have their performances captured for posterity.
Lets hope the film director allows them to all to flourish on film like they did on stage in the early days, unlike their stage director who went on to neuter their performances and turned their once great show into a bad American sitcom with a few hip tunes.
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Post by keekio2 on Jun 7, 2022 3:20:54 GMT
The original cast is in it because no one else will ever compare to the magic they created together. They owned their roles in ways no one has since and deserve to have their performances captured for posterity. Lets hope the film director allows them to all to flourish on film like they did on stage in the early days, unlike their stage director who went on to neuter their performances and turned their once great show into a bad American sitcom with a few hip tunes. The original cast are not Best cast I’m sorry to say but current West End and Broadway cast are on another level also the show is the exact same so I don’t know how it’s changed into a Bad American sitcom but okay |
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Post by showtoones on Jun 7, 2022 6:50:51 GMT
From What I hear, this happened because the cast was upset that Broadway got a recording and OLC of Six did not..
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Post by Paulw on Jun 7, 2022 6:56:37 GMT
Feels right to get the OGs back given how much they did in adding personality to the roles originally Agree and yet so many keyboard warriors seeing it ‘as a slap in the face’ to the current cast. As their first major show I’m sure the creators want that slice of nostalgia too and subsequent casts haven’t really gone too far off what the OGs did so... good luck to them I say. It's not about that, I simply asked a question as to why they keep reverting back to the originals. Lets put this in real life terms if you were in a job that 2 or 3 people had before you and your boss kept going back to the first person that had your job every time anything big happened within your company, only for them to get the accolade and bonus money, would you not feel slightly put out by it? |
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Jun 7, 2022 7:01:41 GMT
I imagine the opinions of the cast are the last thing anyone’s bothered about. This is happening because the producers want to squeeze every last penny out of it before interest starts to wane.
(My personal interest waned about five minutes into the show)
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Post by stagebyte on Jun 7, 2022 8:03:05 GMT
Agree and yet so many keyboard warriors seeing it ‘as a slap in the face’ to the current cast. As their first major show I’m sure the creators want that slice of nostalgia too and subsequent casts haven’t really gone too far off what the OGs did so... good luck to them I say. It's not about that, I simply asked a question as to why they keep reverting back to the originals. Lets put this in real life terms if you were in a job that 2 or 3 people had before you and your boss kept going back to the first person that had your job every time anything big happened within your company, only for them to get the accolade and bonus money, would you not feel slightly put out by it? Do they feel put out by it or are the fans hyping the disappointment to the max? Unsure why there’s so much hostility (not saying you) towards the OC all of a sudden online. I think original casts are original casts for a reason and it’s a good thing to get the alchemy recorded for posterity. I’d love this for every production. Does seem a long time since the OLC but I guess the production are now in a financial position to do this. From what I’ve seen of subsequent casts they seem to be directed towards carbon copies of the OGs anyway. I would imagine it’s Toby and Lucy pushing this. Interesting that for Heathers they used current cast rather than Carrie Hope Fletcher so I guess it’s down to what producers want. |
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Post by venoose on Jun 7, 2022 8:15:58 GMT
The current cast get to do loads of exciting things so I wouldn’t feel too sorry for them. They got to perform for royalty just a couple of days ago at the Jubilee concert and hang out with Lin Manuel Miranda, they’re not exactly hard done by.
I’m obsessed with the current queens but I know full well that a pro shot with the original cast would sell more.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2022 8:44:51 GMT
You could also spin it that the original cast put in the hard work creating and originating the roles and the show to help make it become the phenomenon it is today and the current casts benefit from it with higher profiles and getting to be part of more publicity and bigger events.
That's life, there's always pros and cons to wherever you fall in the history of a job role.
It's no different to any of the other filmed shows or celebratory concerts that brought in bigger names
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Post by intoanewlife on Jun 7, 2022 12:21:02 GMT
The original cast is in it because no one else will ever compare to the magic they created together. They owned their roles in ways no one has since and deserve to have their performances captured for posterity. Lets hope the film director allows them to all to flourish on film like they did on stage in the early days, unlike their stage director who went on to neuter their performances and turned their once great show into a bad American sitcom with a few hip tunes. The original cast are not Best cast I’m sorry to say but current West End and Broadway cast are on another level also the show is the exact same so I don’t know how it’s changed into a Bad American sitcom but okay Bless...you state this with so much conviction it's almost like you're stating a fact. I have no idea what the latest London cast is like and as I doubt I'll be going back to the show again after the last round of 'updates', I will probably never find out unless I have visitors who want to go and see it. So I will just have to take your lone word for it that they are better...but not really...as you think US cast is better...soooo... IMO (see what I did there) apart from Howard (who is fantastic) and Boleyn (who is great but sounds like she should be being pushed around in a pram) the US cast are not great. Aragon is adequate, Parr is well Parr, Seymour is bland and Cleeves is excruciatingly terrible. I guess it all depends what you want from the show. If you want over acting, over singing and overly annoying, then they're amazing at their jobs. If you want subtlety, a sense of irony, excellent comedic timing and don't mind the odd bung note because everything else is so good, then the OG's win hands down. I have seen the show 14 times since January 2019 and apart from the script being the same what's been playing in the West End since the reopening bares very little resemblance to the one that played the Arts for the first 8 months of it's run...ie before it's transformation began. The original is now a very distant fold memory, it is now an exact carbon copy of the one playing on Broadway. |
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Post by partytentdown on Jun 7, 2022 12:26:12 GMT
Haven't seen this since the Arts run and sounds like it's changed a fair bit, what have they done to it?
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Post by intoanewlife on Jun 7, 2022 12:46:05 GMT
I imagine the opinions of the cast are the last thing anyone’s bothered about. This is happening because the producers want to squeeze every last penny out of it before interest starts to wane. (My personal interest waned about five minutes into the show) We get it doll you don't like the show, but do you really need to keep popping in every 3 pages or so to remind us? I hate Phantom and Cats and Les Mis, but I don't go and threadcrap on them on a regular basis...that would be annoying  While the show has lost it's shine for me, I think it is VERY premature to be predicting its demise so soon considering its continuing popularity and expansion. It's still a sellout every night wherever it plays and has very healthy advance bookings as well. Even if it does eventually start to slide, it could easily move off Broadway and run forever because it's running costs are so low. They also have the Asian markets to go as well and if it takes off there they'll really hit paydirt. So I wouldn't count on it going anywhere for the next decade or so. With the live recording now released, there is every likelihood with combined figures that it will become the most streamed Musical soundtrack of all-time. In other words it has achieved what &Juliet (which has been hemorrhaging money since day 1) and Prince of Egypt (which lasted what 6 months?) could only dream of I also think it's a bit naff to imply it's creators wouldn't care about casting for what will be its remaining legacy when it is gone. I mean, I know you hate it, but really? |
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Post by Paddy on Jun 7, 2022 14:02:30 GMT
It really could just be something as simple as contracts.
The original cast could have very easily had first refusal built into their contracts, the show was a complete unknown entity when the original cast joined its not completely out of the realms of possibility that first refusal to a filmed version of the show was agreed at the time.
It’s fairly common for unique clauses to be built into theatre contracts, Lucie Jones getting an out of waitress if she landed Elphaba or Elsa for example, or Heather Headley getting first refusal of the bodyguard on broadway.
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Post by inthenose on Jun 7, 2022 14:41:53 GMT
It really could just be something as simple as contracts. The original cast could have very easily had first refusal built into their contracts, the show was a complete unknown entity when the original cast joined its not completely out of the realms of possibility that first refusal to a filmed version of the show was agreed at the time. It’s fairly common for unique clauses to be built into theatre contracts, Lucie Jones getting an out of waitress if she landed Elphaba or Elsa for example, or Heather Headley getting first refusal of the bodyguard on broadway. I was thinking about this. Say I was a producer of The Bodyguard and didn't want Heather Headley going forward (for whatever reason), but she had first refusal from a prior contract. I wonder if I could "manage her out" of the show by offering Equity minimum. I'm guessing salary is stipulated in the contract! |
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Post by inthenose on Jun 7, 2022 14:46:23 GMT
I imagine the opinions of the cast are the last thing anyone’s bothered about. This is happening because the producers want to squeeze every last penny out of it before interest starts to wane. (My personal interest waned about five minutes into the show) We get it doll you don't like the show, but do you really need to keep popping in every 3 pages or so to remind us? I hate Phantom and Cats and Les Mis, but I don't go and threadcrap on them on a regular basis...that would be annoying While the show has lost it's shine for me, I think it is VERY premature to be predicting its demise so soon considering its continuing popularity and expansion. It's still a sellout every night wherever it plays and has very healthy advance bookings as well. Even if it does eventually start to slide, it could easily move off Broadway and run forever because it's running costs are so low. They also have the Asian markets to go as well and if it takes off there they'll really hit paydirt. So I wouldn't count on it going anywhere for the next decade or so. With the live recording now released, there is every likelihood with combined figures that it will become the most streamed Musical soundtrack of all-time. In other words it has achieved what &Juliet (which has been hemorrhaging money since day 1) and Prince of Egypt (which lasted what 6 months?) could only dream of I also think it's a bit naff to imply it's creators wouldn't care about casting for what will be its remaining legacy when it is gone. I mean, I know you hate it, but really? My only (touch wood!) experience of Six was at West End Live a few years back. The specific memory is of an angry, dubiously dressed woman tunelessly shouting "I'm the queen of the castle, get down you dirty rascal" repeatedly in a South London accent. At that point I genuinely started to question the artistic future of musical theatre. |
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Post by intoanewlife on Jun 7, 2022 15:29:43 GMT
Haven't seen this since the Arts run and sounds like it's changed a fair bit, what have they done to it? It depends when you saw it at the Arts as a lot of the changes happened there before the pandemic. To be fair the first few months could only ever be described as 'scrappy', but that is what also made it so fun. It wasn't until about 3 or 4 months in that the OG's all finally hit their stride vocally and inhabited their characters fully, but their comedic timing was always brilliant. In fact when I ever raved about the show to someone I always described it as a really great standup routine with a few cracking tunes. From memory it started to have minor changes around the time the UK tour started after Canada and Boston and the dreaded 'illness' period ended. These were all great though and improved the show a lot and it was probably the best the show has ever been. The full transition to Broadway replica didn't happen until it re-opened at the Vaudeville, though the worst ones were already in place by the end of the Arts run. Cosmetically it has a fancy new and much bigger lighting rig. Cleeves Broadway costume reveal has been applied, as has the new funky RnB lead-in to Parr's segment. The Ex-Wives dialogue now plays much faster with slightly different music effects...like the rest of the show...more on that later... It is much more 'professional' and much more of a 'show' now and a lot of the changes have definitely improved it. But I really dislike the way they have changed the direction of the comedy/dialogue sections that seemed to arrive with Courtney and never left. I doubt however that it was down to her as Millie always played it a millions miles a minute as do the US cast. The first time I saw it it was so jarring (I think I even posted about it here at the time) I can remember thinking that I hoped they were going to sort that out...they didn't and it got worse. The dialogue scenes used to be quite loose, fun and natural and the pacing of the show and those sections was expertly handled by the original cast who all had great comic timing and knew how to work the audience. Now (well when I saw it last in November) it feels less like a group of scrappy empowered young British women and more like a bunch of entitled American teenagers screaming at each other like chipmunks with British accents. They now all playout at double speed for the first 3/4 of the show, then it comes to a screeching halt at Parr's intro and then goes in slo-motion for 10 minutes (at the only low point of the show) to make up the time they lost by speeding through the rest. A lot of the jokes are completely lost throughout as there is no downtime allowed for audience laughter or applause (even after songs half the time) they just keep/start talking and speed through everything like the audience isn't even there and there's a ticking time bomb in the building. Maybe it's a TikTock generation thing? Where something can't have a normal pace anymore and we just have to rush straight from one thing to the next? The 'messaging' which was always there but was originally quite subtle and if you got it, you got it and if you didn't, well it didn't really matter, is now delivered with Thor's hammer. It all slightly feels a bit like Isaac's statement on Legally Blonde the other day now...which is fine...I am not their target audience now they're a phenomenon...even though I paid to see it 14 times...10 times in Premium seating. But part of the greatness of the show was hearing these things you'd never even considered before, learning things and being moved by them. It's still there, it just feels different because of the change in tone. The thing that annoyed me most however was some of the OG's original 'moments' had changed. Jarneia's 'running around with some pretty young thing' running stomp, that only she did...gone. Natalie no longer brilliantly emoted her way through Heart of Stone...she just stood there...like a cardboard cut out...and didn't move...or emote...just like Samantha Pauly does...until YEEEEEEEAH and she finally does something. Like that is the only part of that song that warrants emotion. It's not like they were doing major damage to the show by being there, so why change them? |
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Post by intoanewlife on Jun 7, 2022 15:46:48 GMT
We get it doll you don't like the show, but do you really need to keep popping in every 3 pages or so to remind us? I hate Phantom and Cats and Les Mis, but I don't go and threadcrap on them on a regular basis...that would be annoying  While the show has lost it's shine for me, I think it is VERY premature to be predicting its demise so soon considering its continuing popularity and expansion. It's still a sellout every night wherever it plays and has very healthy advance bookings as well. Even if it does eventually start to slide, it could easily move off Broadway and run forever because it's running costs are so low. They also have the Asian markets to go as well and if it takes off there they'll really hit paydirt. So I wouldn't count on it going anywhere for the next decade or so. With the live recording now released, there is every likelihood with combined figures that it will become the most streamed Musical soundtrack of all-time. In other words it has achieved what &Juliet (which has been hemorrhaging money since day 1) and Prince of Egypt (which lasted what 6 months?) could only dream of I also think it's a bit naff to imply it's creators wouldn't care about casting for what will be its remaining legacy when it is gone. I mean, I know you hate it, but really? My only (touch wood!) experience of Six was at West End Live a few years back. The specific memory is of an angry, dubiously dressed woman tunelessly shouting "I'm the queen of the castle, get down you dirty rascal" repeatedly in a South London accent. At that point I genuinely started to question the artistic future of musical theatre. I originally got dragged to it by a friend whose favorite song is 'the Venga Bus is coming', so you can imagine my reluctance in going. I watched a clip from it online and thought it looked atrocious and then the clip after it played which was a couple of theatre reviewers who gave it an ecstatic review so I thought ooookay. I cannot deny that first night was one of the best nights I've ever had in a theatre. At the end of the day it's a school project that someone important saw and loved the idea of and expanded, I don't think anyone involved in it ever imagined that it would become what it has. I highly doubt they think they are the future of British Theatre, they came up with a fun cabaret show (as was their 2nd show) the kind you'd usually see drag queens perform at the RVT on a Wednesday night and struck gold. What should they have done? Say 'oh actually it's a pile of sh*t please take your millions back as this show is beneath us'? Everyone has to start somewhere, they just got very VERY lucky. |
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Jun 7, 2022 16:47:31 GMT
I imagine the opinions of the cast are the last thing anyone’s bothered about. This is happening because the producers want to squeeze every last penny out of it before interest starts to wane. (My personal interest waned about five minutes into the show) We get it doll you don't like the show, but do you really need to keep popping in every 3 pages or so to remind us? I hate Phantom and Cats and Les Mis, but I don't go and threadcrap on them on a regular basis...that would be annoying Lol 😂. My last post in this thread was October 21 and that was about a correction to the title. My last post in the tour thread, September 20 and that was a link to to our tickets. As you were 🙂 |
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Post by fiyerorocher on Jun 7, 2022 19:15:35 GMT
I’m not sure I really get the idolisation of the ‘Original London Cast’ because they… weren’t? the? original? London? cast? The cast on the original cast recording performed at the arts first, and are probably still my favourite cast.
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Post by partytentdown on Jun 7, 2022 19:46:57 GMT
I often wonder how the six random uni students who did this feel!
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Post by Paddy on Jun 7, 2022 20:43:03 GMT
It really could just be something as simple as contracts. The original cast could have very easily had first refusal built into their contracts, the show was a complete unknown entity when the original cast joined its not completely out of the realms of possibility that first refusal to a filmed version of the show was agreed at the time. It’s fairly common for unique clauses to be built into theatre contracts, Lucie Jones getting an out of waitress if she landed Elphaba or Elsa for example, or Heather Headley getting first refusal of the bodyguard on broadway. I was thinking about this. Say I was a producer of The Bodyguard and didn't want Heather Headley going forward (for whatever reason), but she had first refusal from a prior contract. I wonder if I could "manage her out" of the show by offering Equity minimum. I'm guessing salary is stipulated in the contract! Well if you believe the rumours it’s apparently a factor in why the bodyguard has never headed to broadway, it’s only ever toured. Obviously many other factors as well but a buy out clause would most certainly be factored into the contract. I find the intricacies and ambiguity of media contracts very fascinating. |
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Post by FairyGodmother on Jun 8, 2022 22:55:10 GMT
I often wonder how the six random uni students who did this feel! Slightly bemused I should think.  At the Fringe I remember people really really liking it, but more as a pastiche of 90s/early 00s singers and song styles. Clever lyrics, some good tunes and with a good concept, but not "Amazing Innovative New Show That Will Be An Instant Hit and Will Run For Years!!!!" It also seemed more aimed at my (late twenties/early thirties) age group than the teens it now seems to attract. |
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Post by ncbears on Jun 11, 2022 13:46:17 GMT
Oops. Forgot yesterday to try for the 1 July tix for the filming. Well, we have Jerusalem tix that evening anyway.
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Post by raider80 on Jun 11, 2022 19:26:50 GMT
This is a bit off topic but Lucy and Toby are writing the opening number for the the Tony Awards.
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Post by h86 on Jun 12, 2022 11:14:29 GMT
I’ve noticed that this week they have had to bring one of the past tour alternates in, Harriet, to cover numerous tracks.
It’s mad that they have 3 West end alternates and 2 West end swings and this is not enough to provide cover.
When the show was on with only 3 alternates in 2019 they had a couple of situations where they didn’t have enough cover but at the moment it just seems to be very constant which is surprising as they have 5 permanent covers!
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Post by aingidh on Jun 12, 2022 11:41:43 GMT
5 generally does seem to be enough in most circumstances, but on some occasions like this week where multiple illnesses and holidays coincide, they struggle.
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