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Post by distantcousin on Mar 5, 2019 9:07:03 GMT
I don't see why it is a problem that people are passionate about a show (obviously not talking about the ones that take it too far). In an awards show that is voted by the public those who bother to mobilise their army of fans to vote are always going to win. It happens every year. They are like the theatre equivalent of the Smash Hits awards where I voted for Take That in every single category, including all those they were not nominated for ☺
Totally. I don't subscribe to awards for arts at the best of times, but these thinly veiled popularity contests are even worse.
Whatsonstage awards used to be quite fair, but in the online world we're living in, they are just a perfect avenue for people and shows that have the greatest online following.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2019 9:07:35 GMT
I think also there's a difference between someone with a small (no offense Daniel!) social media following who hasn't tagged anyone in the production or the show, offering their opinion, and say tagging all the cast and shouting it if you've got say 10k followers. It's of course PTM prerogative to block whoever he wants but it does seem a TINY bit dramatic given it was just an opinion on his show that he'd clearly gone looking for as nobody was tagged etc.
Obviously, rule of thumb is don't type anything you wouldn't say, but a generic 'I didn't really enjoy this show/performance/recording' etc is a reasonable audience comment IMO.
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4,789 posts
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Post by Mark on Mar 5, 2019 9:22:20 GMT
Oh it was fabulous. So much fun! Now, I'm not the type to buy into the hype until I see a show. I havent rushed to see Hamilton, I saw Harry Potter a year and a half later and I didn't stress myself out booking and got a cheap ticket on the day. The cast overall were fantastic. Carrie and Jamie were both great, really fantastic. The two jocks were hilarious, as were the other two Heathers. But the obvious standout was Jodie Stelle, who I thought was simply outstanding, amazing! What a performance! And a surprising turn, Hugh Maynard was off and in his place was Mr. Nathan Amzi! He was there though, nothing special about his performance really. The show itself was hilarious. Alot of fun, great songs and performance to match. The set was, again there, it added nothing too it, and considering PTM realeased that statement saying he was putting on a "big show" I didn't quite see that from a visual sense. I also love wd the lighting design. Alot of bold choices that worked well. The audience were on another level.aybe a quarter men and the rest women. So many people were dressed as the Heathers or wearing merch, it was crazy! And when Carrie came on I thought yep, entrance applause, of course, but holy crap, when the Heathers arrived it blew Carrie's applause away. After every song it wasnt just cheering, it was screaming! It was crazy. But otherwise, a thoroughly well behaved audience, only cheering and going crazy when appropriate. Instant standing ovation, it was great. I'll definitely try to catch again before it leaves. A great show!  * Oh, and those following the Steve thing, he was on the end of the fourth row tonight. Find all the negativity quite unusual seeing as though you aparantly enjoyed the show Daniel! |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2019 9:30:11 GMT
I mean... it is completely possible to see a show and greatly enjoy it, but also to find the cast recording underwhelming and think that other shows were better? What's your point here exactly?
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4,789 posts
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Post by Mark on Mar 5, 2019 9:35:48 GMT
I mean... it is completely possible to see a show and greatly enjoy it, but also to find the cast recording underwhelming and think that other shows were better? What's your point here exactly? Because the negativity was at the show (and Carrie) winning the award and not the cast album? A reaction was clearly sought and it was received. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2019 9:43:13 GMT
I mean... it is completely possible to see a show and greatly enjoy it, but also to find the cast recording underwhelming and think that other shows were better? What's your point here exactly? Ditto. I had a jolly enough time at the show. I’m admittedly trash for CHF but that cast recording was a resounding “meh” so “meh” in fact I didn’t even summon the energy to tweet about it... |
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Post by MrsCondomine on Mar 5, 2019 9:49:54 GMT
I'm glad I saw Olivia Moore rather than CHF, based on this album.
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Post by winonaforever on Mar 5, 2019 10:28:17 GMT
Well I'm a massive Heathers fan and saw the show a LOT. I'm enjoying the cast recording, but do prefer the off Broadway OCR.
Apart from Jamie Muscato that is, who is perfect as JD, much better than Ryan McCartan (I saw the NY cast several times too)
I'm livid Jamie didn't win Best Actor in a musical at the What's On Stage awards!
Becky Lock also sounds great on the new recording.
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728 posts
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Post by sophie92 on Mar 5, 2019 11:06:48 GMT
I think also there's a difference between someone with a small (no offense Daniel!) social media following who hasn't tagged anyone in the production or the show, offering their opinion, and say tagging all the cast and shouting it if you've got say 10k followers. It's of course PTM prerogative to block whoever he wants but it does seem a TINY bit dramatic given it was just an opinion on his show that he'd clearly gone looking for as nobody was tagged etc. Not to drag this out any further, but just for fairness, PTM actually was tagged in the Twitter thread/post that resulted in Daniel being blocked (as well as the show twitter, and both of the writers). Not deliberately tagged, just a result of being tagged in the photo in the WOS tweet that was replied to and no-one removing them from tweets. Anyway, PTM didn’t have to go hunting for those tweets, they would’ve been in his mentions |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2019 13:31:23 GMT
Well, assume they have come back down to earth today - number of Olivier nominations - zero.
Was mainly (quite rightly I think) about Company and Come From Away.
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Post by danb on Mar 5, 2019 15:16:32 GMT
Well, assume they have come back down to earth today - number of Olivier nominations - zero. Was mainly (quite rightly I think) about Company and Come From Away. ...but if there was a ‘Best Set on Castors’ award... |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2019 16:22:27 GMT
Oh it was fabulous. So much fun! Now, I'm not the type to buy into the hype until I see a show. I havent rushed to see Hamilton, I saw Harry Potter a year and a half later and I didn't stress myself out booking and got a cheap ticket on the day. The cast overall were fantastic. Carrie and Jamie were both great, really fantastic. The two jocks were hilarious, as were the other two Heathers. But the obvious standout was Jodie Stelle, who I thought was simply outstanding, amazing! What a performance! And a surprising turn, Hugh Maynard was off and in his place was Mr. Nathan Amzi! He was there though, nothing special about his performance really. The show itself was hilarious. Alot of fun, great songs and performance to match. The set was, again there, it added nothing too it, and considering PTM realeased that statement saying he was putting on a "big show" I didn't quite see that from a visual sense. I also love wd the lighting design. Alot of bold choices that worked well. The audience were on another level.aybe a quarter men and the rest women. So many people were dressed as the Heathers or wearing merch, it was crazy! And when Carrie came on I thought yep, entrance applause, of course, but holy crap, when the Heathers arrived it blew Carrie's applause away. After every song it wasnt just cheering, it was screaming! It was crazy. But otherwise, a thoroughly well behaved audience, only cheering and going crazy when appropriate. Instant standing ovation, it was great. I'll definitely try to catch again before it leaves. A great show! * Oh, and those following the Steve thing, he was on the end of the fourth row tonight. Find all the negativity quite unusual seeing as though you aparantly enjoyed the show Daniel! I've never said I didn't like the show, it was good fun with some great performances. But I've also not been a fan of how the fanbase present themselves on social media, as well as some of the behind the scenes behavior on social media, or otherwise. And the fact it won Best Musical last night was laughable as it really wasn't anywhere nesr the best musical of last year, especially considering at least two of its other nominees. And it's kinda an agreement from a fair few that the Cast Recording is a dissapointment, especially considering it was hyped up and delayed for so long by the Producer. Anywho, back to the show, shame Jamie didn't get an Olivier nom but otherwise, it's what we expected from the nominations. |
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Post by andrew on Mar 5, 2019 17:39:50 GMT
Find all the negativity quite unusual seeing as though you aparantly enjoyed the show Daniel! I've never said I didn't like the show, it was good fun with some great performances. But I've also not been a fan of how the fanbase present themselves on social media, as well as some of the behind the scenes behavior on social media, or otherwise. And the fact it won Best Musical last night was laughable as it really wasn't anywhere nesr the best musical of last year, especially considering at least two of its other nominees. And it's kinda an agreement from a fair few that the Cast Recording is a dissapointment, especially considering it was hyped up and delayed for so long by the Producer. Anywho, back to the show, shame Jamie didn't get an Olivier nom but otherwise, it's what we expected from the nominations. It's clearly your fault that you associate your opinion on an artistic product based on social media users and comments. If the show's online fanbase affected your opinion on the show itself the same way the producer's hype affected your opinion on the soundtrack, maybe you should reflect on who you are following on social media instead of dragging the show in every possible instance. |
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4,021 posts
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Post by Dawnstar on Mar 5, 2019 18:26:33 GMT
Obviously, rule of thumb is don't type anything you wouldn't say, but a generic 'I didn't really enjoy this show/performance/recording' etc is a reasonable audience comment IMO. This may not be a useful rule of thumb for those of us who have told a director to his face how much they disliked one of his productions! |
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19,676 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Mar 5, 2019 18:32:10 GMT
Obviously, rule of thumb is don't type anything you wouldn't say, but a generic 'I didn't really enjoy this show/performance/recording' etc is a reasonable audience comment IMO. This may not be a useful rule of thumb for those of us who have told a director to his face how much they disliked one of his productions! Ok..... you’re not going to leave that there Dawnstar? Spill! |
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Post by danb on Mar 5, 2019 18:40:33 GMT
Obviously, rule of thumb is don't type anything you wouldn't say, but a generic 'I didn't really enjoy this show/performance/recording' etc is a reasonable audience comment IMO. This may not be a useful rule of thumb for those of us who have told a director to his face how much they disliked one of his productions! I shook Andy Fickmans hand and told him how much I enjoyed it. Even I wouldn’t be rude enough to offer up a negative opinion unless they asked for it, not even to @ them on twitter. A message board is a place for people to own and share opinions. Twitter appears to be a place for people to attack others directly, and they don’t even need to @ them. If someone has a suspicion they are getting mentions they only have to search. |
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4,021 posts
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Post by Dawnstar on Mar 5, 2019 21:08:17 GMT
This may not be a useful rule of thumb for those of us who have told a director to his face how much they disliked one of his productions! Ok..... you’re not going to leave that there Dawnstar ? Spill! Eugene Onegin at the ROH in 2013, directed by the then Director of Opera Kasper Holten. I hated it, especially the dancer doubles for the 2 main characters. I bumped into him at the Sam Wanamaker Playhouse when I was seeing his production of L'Ormindo, which I loved. So I first told him how much I loved L'Ormindo then said I was amazed that he could direct both a production that I loved and a production that I disliked as much as Eugene Onegin. Given he was at the time in charge of commissioning productions - and had a string of them that were fairly unpopular with both reviewers & audiences - I didn't see why I couldn't tell him what I disliked as well as what I liked. |
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Post by danb on Mar 5, 2019 21:13:48 GMT
Ok..... you’re not going to leave that there Dawnstar ? Spill! Eugene Onegin at the ROH in 2013, directed by the then Director of Opera Kasper Holten. I hated it, especially the dancer doubles for the 2 main characters. I bumped into him at the Sam Wanamaker Playhouse when I was seeing his production of L'Ormindo, which I loved. So I first told him how much I loved L'Ormindo then said I was amazed that he could direct both a production that I loved and a production that I disliked as much as Eugene Onegin. Given he was at the time in charge of commissioning productions - and had a string of them that were fairly unpopular with both reviewers & audiences - I didn't see why I couldn't tell him what I disliked as well as what I liked. Sounds perfectly reasonable... |
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Post by eliza on Mar 5, 2019 21:47:13 GMT
I liked Heathers enough to see it twice, but I don't think it was as good as Hamilton, and while I probably enjoyed Heathers more than Company due to my love of the film and the idea of a musical about murder being right up my alley, I think Company was probably better done and more deserving of awards.
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182 posts
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Post by tom on Mar 5, 2019 22:07:06 GMT
Anybody even discussing the whatsonstage awards aka the who can get the most people from twitter to vote for them awards needs a reality check. This only won anything because Carrie Hope Influencer was in it.
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315 posts
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Post by westended on Mar 6, 2019 7:50:04 GMT
The only reason Heathers won anything at the WoS Awards was because the vote was decided by the public. As Heathers has a huge fan base obviously the fans would vote for the show they love.
It proves that Six is an amazing show if both the public and a panel of judges (at the Olivier Awards) nominate this show. If Heathers was as good as everyone thought was, it would have been up for a few awards....it wasn’t.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2019 8:54:03 GMT
The Oliviers are no more a barometer of quality than the WhatsOnStage awards. The 'Heathers' fanbase liked that show more than others, the Oliviers committee didn't. But then again, the Oliviers committee has nominated Keir Charles for 'Quiz' which by itself is enough evidence that the Oliviers are just as laughable and that's before you even look at what else they nominated.
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1,210 posts
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Post by musicalmarge on Mar 6, 2019 9:19:12 GMT
The Oliviers are no more a barometer of quality than the WhatsOnStage awards. The 'Heathers' fanbase liked that show more than others, the Oliviers committee didn't. But then again, the Oliviers committee has nominated Keir Charles for 'Quiz' which by itself is enough evidence that the Oliviers are just as laughable and that's before you even look at what else they nominated. I don’t think that’s true. What’s on stage is voted by a completely different demographic (basically the tech savvy young audience of West End Live) and the Oliviers by seasoned professionals, professional critics and long standing members of the British theatre industry. |
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Post by danb on Mar 6, 2019 9:20:18 GMT
What we need to move away from on here is the notion of someone being right or wrong when it comes to critical thinking. Opinion and personal preference are just that, and the same is true of awards shows & nominations. It’s still just a panel of people saying what they liked best versus, potentially, the whole of the world voting for what they like best. Putting additional weight or worth behind the Oliviers over the WOS awards is flawed. As a casual observer it just appears to be a way of the twitterati trying to pit Six against Heathers which doesn’t really help supposed fandoms in the long run, and I’m
pretty sure it doesn’t earn them the respect and adulation of the performers that they seem to so desperately seek. It just makes them look like bitter kids. Just wait til you have to start paying a mortgage! 😆
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2019 9:20:52 GMT
and the Oliviers by seasoned professionals, professional critics and long standing members of the British theatre industry. Which makes some of their choices even more laughable and still doesn't make them any more or less important or worthy than the WhatsOnStage awards. |
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