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Post by sprampster on Mar 16, 2022 16:16:50 GMT
Have to say Urdang did a great production of this with a diverse cast and several roles cast against normal "type" and they did also change or exclude some characters or lines or phrases as the production team and cast felt that they were no longer relevant or in some ways offensive.
Interesting that Gay or European still stayed. Which is essentially a musical number where the main character minces around on stage and delivers a totally stereotyped and in some ways offensive portrayal of a gay man.
This show HAS dated in a short space of time. However also its entertaining, funny and when done well also moving. Do we need to be ticking boxes with every show now produced for fear of upset.
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Post by LaLuPone on Mar 16, 2022 16:34:47 GMT
I hope Gay or European doesn’t end up getting taken away/toned down. I’m gay as can be and find it hilarious and I’m sure most of us do!
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Post by FairyGodmother on Mar 16, 2022 17:51:09 GMT
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Post by princeton on Mar 16, 2022 18:21:47 GMT
Not her hands - that's the poster from the original Broadway production (with a bit of DIY photoshopping going on!)
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Post by LaLuPone on Mar 16, 2022 18:21:53 GMT
I’m pretty sure she’s photoshopped herself in to a Laura Bell Bundy photo so they’re not her hands!! princeton great minds! |
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Post by pomegranate on Mar 16, 2022 18:34:39 GMT
Lmaooooo her hands??? You didn’t notice the floating head first?? Lol |
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Post by mrbarnaby on Mar 16, 2022 20:03:08 GMT
Well this casting is spectacularly wrong. Pass.
Getting a little sick of appropriate casting being sidelined to be ‘diverse’.
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Post by FairyGodmother on Mar 16, 2022 20:34:27 GMT
Of course it is. I just thought they'd copied the poster but it looked awkward.  I'll have to go and look at the hands in the 'proper' version now! |
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Post by pomegranate on Mar 16, 2022 20:52:39 GMT
Well this casting is spectacularly wrong. Pass. Getting a little sick of appropriate casting being sidelined to be ‘diverse’. What’s wrong about it? |
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Post by shady23 on Mar 16, 2022 20:55:04 GMT
I'm guessing it's a fictional story so I really don't see how the roles need to always be played by the same kind of performer.
If you do then putting the same show on time and time again would soon become very boring.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2022 20:59:34 GMT
I seem to have missed the memo that says only people with naturally blonde hair and a size 6 figure can play Elle Woods.
Oh wait - Reece Witherspoon isn't a natural blonde either.
Well done to Courtney Bowman, I'm sure she will smash it.
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Post by h86 on Mar 16, 2022 21:01:09 GMT
Well this casting is spectacularly wrong. Pass. Getting a little sick of appropriate casting being sidelined to be ‘diverse’. I wish there was a thumbs down button to dislike this post. |
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Post by sprampster on Mar 16, 2022 21:14:54 GMT
Well this casting is spectacularly wrong. Pass. Getting a little sick of appropriate casting being sidelined to be ‘diverse’. I wish there was a thumbs down button to dislike this post. Why ? I think it’s a pretty valid statement to make. It does seem in some respects like an intentional statement casting as opposed to casting for the most relevance to the role as written ?? |
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Post by danb on Mar 16, 2022 21:18:21 GMT
Theres nothing ‘wrong’ with it, it just won’t be the same show as before.
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Post by inthenose on Mar 16, 2022 21:25:10 GMT
I just hate the predictability of it. When it was announced, immediately I knew this would be "non-traditional" casting. My issue with this is that producers should be about *everyone* getting a fair shake at audition. Keeping every option open, seeing people who previously wouldn't get seen. And who knows, you can uncover a gem of a performance just from keeping an open mind.
So many shows right now are actively going out and looking to hire POC and minorities, which absolutely defeats the whole point of harmony and inclusiveism. Affirmative action is no better or more progressive than whitewashing. The best people for appropriate parts is all anyone wants.
In an ideal world, the best auditionees of all backgrounds would get the parts they are appropriate for, without a show having a preconceived "vision", or intention to make a statement by casting non-traditionally.
It's all just so terribly predictable.
That said, I was never going to see this anyway, it's not a show I enjoyed at the Savoy.
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Post by Paddy on Mar 16, 2022 21:39:07 GMT
I just hate the predictability of it. When it was announced, immediately I knew this would be "non-traditional" casting. My issue with this is that producers should be about *everyone* getting a fair shake at audition. Keeping every option open, seeing people who previously wouldn't get seen. And who knows, you can uncover a gem of a performance just from keeping an open mind. So many shows right now are actively going out and looking to hire POC and minorities, which absolutely defeats the whole point of harmony and inclusiveism. Affirmative action is no better or more progressive than whitewashing. The best people for appropriate parts is all anyone wants. In an ideal world, the best auditionees of all backgrounds would get the parts they are appropriate for, without a show having a preconceived "vision", or intention to make a statement by casting non-traditionally. It's all just so terribly predictable. That said, I was never going to see this anyway, it's not a show I enjoyed at the Savoy. How do you know that because it has been cast “non traditionally” that it hasn’t been cast based on merit? How do you know they didn’t see every girl who wanted to audition for Elle no matter how “traditional” they were or not and Courtney was the best out of the bunch? She’s a great singer, great comedic actor and will give a completely different but brilliant take on the role. Plenty of the other roles have been cast “traditionally” so why is this such an issue? |
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Post by budd on Mar 16, 2022 21:45:02 GMT
Elle Woods' defining characteristics are that she's relatively well-to-do, naive, loves fashion, and appears, on the surface (as with everything about this) to be shallow. Unless you mean that those things can only be embodied by white skinny girls, which well done, great stereotyping and also missing the point of the story anyway, in an attempt to "uphold" it or whatever.
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Post by lolalou on Mar 16, 2022 21:54:36 GMT
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Post by Paddy on Mar 16, 2022 22:09:11 GMT
Ok….. that makes it even more sad that you think people who look like you shouldn’t be given a chance in different roles Where did I say that? I said the best people should be given roles regardless of their race, if they are suitable for the part. It shouldn't be the default position to slot in POC in order to balance the books. Again, how do you know that wasn’t the case here? Unless you know every single woman that was seen for Elle it’s not exactly fair to insinuate that the casting was not based purely on merit AND was able to diversity casting in multiple ways. I actually think having a woman of colour adds an extra layer of nuance to the role. She is a young woman trying to break into the legal profession, a profession notorious for nepotism and lack of diversity. Her not being taken serious in her pursuit of what she wants is even more realistic |
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Post by christya on Mar 16, 2022 22:14:55 GMT
Personally I don't give a damn what race Elle is, so long as she remains blonde (which she will) but I find a plus size Elle a bit unbelievable. A plus size woman who acted like Elle or tried to exist in those spaces would not be perceived in the same way at all. She'd be more likely to be told there was nothing for her in the clothing shop than to end up in a conversation about using a half loop stitch on china silk. Maybe they'll tweak the script or something, but I suspect they'll just pretend that things like that wouldn't happen.
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Post by danb on Mar 16, 2022 22:15:02 GMT
She is not taken seriously because she is an airhead, vacuous blonde. Will another layer of meaning be added?
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Post by partytentdown on Mar 16, 2022 22:19:04 GMT
"Can Elle Woods be black?" is this year's "why isn't Jessie Buckley on tonight?"
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Post by Paddy on Mar 16, 2022 22:20:43 GMT
She is not taken seriously because she is an airhead, vacuous blonde. Will another layer of meaning be added? Isn’t the whole point that she’s not actually an airhead though, just judged to be one based her on looks and not much else? |
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Post by christya on Mar 16, 2022 22:24:59 GMT
She is not taken seriously because she is an airhead, vacuous blonde. Will another layer of meaning be added? I hope they'll actually DO something to add it, otherwise it's approaching unforgivably ignorant. As a plus-size person, I want to be happy about this casting. I wish people had been willing to do stuff like this back when I was a teenager and desperately wanted to be in musical theatre but found no place for myself there. But I also don't want to spend an evening watching everyone pretend that Elle being larger wouldn't change her experience. I think I'll wait to hear more about this one before deciding if I'm willing to go. |
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Post by shady23 on Mar 16, 2022 22:30:27 GMT
Ok….. that makes it even more sad that you think people who look like you shouldn’t be given a chance in different roles Where did I say that? I said the best people should be given roles regardless of their race, if they are suitable for the part. It shouldn't be the default position to slot in POC in order to balance the books. And there lies the problem... Whenever a person of colour is cast we always have people saying they are there just because of their race. People say they don't care who gets the role so long as they are the best person for the role but this kind of discussion just does not happen if a white person is cast. It is only said when a person of colour is cast. It shows what a long way there is to go, sadly. |
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