Come to our new play. What's it about? Guess!

[jadnoop]

(This is a thread about a discussion I'd like to bring up about new plays generally, rather than a specific play, so I'm not sure if this is the right place, or if it should be in the 'General Chat' thread. If so, apologies and I can delete/try to move it).

I'm probably more of a casual theatre-goer than most of the posters here, but since moving back to London and having a little more disposable income I've been attending plays more regularly, and an issue has arisen that I thought might make interesting discussion, and provide useful for less knowledgeable theatre-goers here like me.

I'm enjoying attending new plays. Two of those I've enjoyed/am looking forward to most this year are new ones; The Ferryman and Mosquitoes. However, on deciding on booking tickets, I've noticed something that's pretty frustrating about the way these plays can be presented to the public. The websites typically give very little information about the play itself, either in terms of some broad synopsis/story outline, or even what type of play it is (e.g. is it a thriller, a comedy, etc.). Indeed, most of the pages that accompany the 'book here' buttons seem to just include a couple of vague & non-commital sentences along with a single -typically abstract- image.

For example, Ferryman had "Northern Ireland, 1981. The Carney farmhouse is a hive of activity with preparations for the annual harvest. A day of hard work on the land and a traditional night of feasting and celebrations lie ahead. But this year they will be interrupted by a visitor.", while Mosquitoes has a little more "Alice is a scientist. She lives in Geneva. As the Large Hadron particle collider starts up in 2008, she is on the brink of the most exciting work of her life, searching for the Higgs Boson. Jenny is her sister. She lives in Luton. She spends a lot of time Googling. When tragedy throws them together, the collision threatens them all with chaos."

I appreciate that in both cases the lines are definitely enigmatic, but they don't really give much for a potential audience to make an informed decision on.

Presumably the practicalities of staging a new play makes it difficult to say much; the script is still being finalised, the sets/costumes/etc aren't in place making photos difficult and so on. Furthermore, in some media have gone too far in terms of giving away 'too much information', e.g. the trailers for some movies seem to spoil the entire thing. However, some of these websites seem so vague as to be irrelevant, requiring audiences to base their decisions largely on prior knowledge about the people involved rather than the play itself. Do you know the star? Do you know the playwright? And so on. While that might be fine for seasoned theatre-goers, it strikes me as quite opaque for newcomers who don't have much prior knowledge to go on. Compounding this is the fact that popular smaller plays might be sold out long before press night, giving casual theatre-goers little chance of getting tickets by the time they read about something in their paper.

Apologies for the waffling mini-rant, but I guess my thoughts/questions are, how do people decide on the plays here? Do you do a fair bit of reading around (playwrite interviews and so on)? Do you just bulk book and then return? Do you have access to secret knowledge outside of the general releases? Or perhaps it's not really such a big issue outside of a very small number of 'big names in a small theatre' type events? And day returns and schemes like the NT's Friday Rush gives people enough access anyway?

[Deleted]

At theatres like the National, Royal Court, Young Vic, Old Vic, Donmar, and Almeida, I start with the assumption I'm going to see everything, then whittle it down from there. For instance, I dislike Upstairs at the Royal Court so I'll only see something there if I know I like the playwright or the minuscule blurb manages to pique my interest sufficiently, but book pretty much everything Downstairs. And I'm done with the likes of Richard Bean and Harold Pinter so will happily pass over those when they arise. I can be won around fairly easily if an actor I particularly like gets cast in something, but that's by no means a cast iron guarantee. I think this booking method works so well for me because I know I can get an acceptable ticket for less than £20 in all of these venues.

In a theatre like the Hampstead, I work backwards; I know I'd want to spend more than £20 on a ticket there, so I do rely on the blurbs. But not just the blurbs. As you point out, they can be unhelpfully brief, so I'll also look at the creatives. The current season is extremely masculine in terms of writers and directors, so I'm holding off on booking until casting is announced (apart from Gloria, which I already booked because the playwright came so highly recommended).

I think on the board here, you probably will find a lot of us are more willing to book things with little knowledge on the grounds that we know which theatres will take our tickets back, or because we know we want to see as many plays as possible anyway so we're happy to take the gamble. It would be much more interesting to track down the average theatre-goer in the street who isn't quite so immersed in the whole thing as we are, and find out what their answers are. They'd doubtless be much more enlightening than ours.

[Deleted]

Jun 6, 2017 14:41:40 GMT @baemax said:

At theatres like the National, Royal Court, Young Vic, Old Vic, Donmar, and Almeida, I start with the assumption I'm going to see everything, then whittle it down from there. I dislike Upstairs at the Royal Court so I'll only see something there if I know I like the playwright or the minuscule blurb manages to pique my interest sufficiently. I'm done with the likes of Richard Bean and Harold Pinter so will pass over those when they arise. I can be won around fairly easily if an actor I particularly like gets cast in something, but that's by no means a cast iron guarantee. I think this booking method works so well for me because I know I can get an acceptable ticket for less than £20 in all of these venues.

Which is all very well if you're in a position TO do that. Being within reasonable commuting distance etc etc (I know you're aware of that I'm just leading to my next point)

I'm inclined to agree that I see far less new writing in London, simply because it's not worth a gamble on a train ticket that is frankly bankrupting and/or a 7 hour round trip bus journey for something I know next to nothing about. If I find myself there with nothing on sure I might give it a go, but the truth of it is, I only ever as the OP says find out retrospectively and think 'Oh that sounded good'

That said locally I'm more inclined to take a punt on an unknown, and frequently do with little or no knowledge. So I don't think it's neccesarily that it's lack of knowledge of the actual plays just the investment needed to get to them (both in money and in time etc) if it's 10 minutes away and £8 I'll give almost anything a go. If it's 4 hours away and going to cost a fortune most of us won't!

But generally I'd imagine we're the crowd to give it a bash even blind!

[Deleted]

This point of convenience also is very true! I'd be no more likely to investigate a piece of new writing in Sheffield than I would be to attend a Richard Bean retrospective! I have occasionally gone to Bristol for new writing, but only for playwrights who have been FIRMLY established as favourites and it was either drive to Bristol which I know reasonably well or risk Birmingham which I only ever pass through.

[Deleted]

Jun 6, 2017 14:50:21 GMT @baemax said:

This point of convenience also is very true! I'd be no more likely to investigate a piece of new writing in Sheffield than I would be to attend a Richard Bean retrospective! I have occasionally gone to Bristol for new writing, but only for playwrights who have been FIRMLY established as favourites and it was either drive to Bristol which I know reasonably well or risk Birmingham which I only ever pass through.

When I was young and innocent, I arranged an entire weekend in Bristol pegged around seeing Kneehigh's Cymbeline. I think you can imagine the chagrin with which I viewed my credit card bill that month!

[martin1965]

Personally i know by now what and who i like so i target theatres: RSC, National, old and young vic and the loke. I dont have the funds or inclination to go and see for instance anything the National puts on.

[zahidf]

Depends on

-Theatre putting it on
-Any creatives/actors announced
-Price
-How quickly stuff sells out.

I'll give new stuff a chance, I am just unlikely to by it in advance without more details.

[Deleted]

Jun 6, 2017 14:50:21 GMT @baemax said:

This point of convenience also is very true! I'd be no more likely to investigate a piece of new writing in Sheffield than I would be to attend a Richard Bean retrospective! I have occasionally gone to Bristol for new writing, but only for playwrights who have been FIRMLY established as favourites and it was either drive to Bristol which I know reasonably well or risk Birmingham which I only ever pass through.

You could go to Bristol I believe people do...also it has a lovely suspension bridge  

But it is really always a matter of convience/knowledge of SOMETHING to do with the prodcution. I say I'll see 'Anything' locally but let's be frank, if it's a director/playwright/actor who gets on my wick I'm not driving 10 minutes out of my way. However I'd say for a playwright I know OF and like and/or a company doing it I like I would go a certain distance if I am able. 

[jadnoop]

Thanks for all of the comments. It's reassuring to hear that it's not simply down to some secret fountain of theatre 'new play' knowledge that I don't know about yet

I suppose part of the issue is that, despite them getting closer in price, getting theatre tickets always feels more loaded than getting cinema tickets. I feel worse sitting through a bad play than I do going to a bad film, but then missing a movie in the cinema, you feel like you can always see it on DVD, but theatre is so fleeting. It doesn't help that I also feel guilty returning tickets...

[Deleted]

I always find this habit either to be exciting, for example The Ferryman or The Children.
Though I did book for Oil at the Almeida based on the poster alone, yeah... that was a mistake.

[Deleted]

Jun 6, 2017 16:31:06 GMT jadnoop said:

Thanks for all of the comments. It's reassuring to hear that it's not simply down to some secret fountain of theatre 'new play' knowledge that I don't know about yet

I suppose part of the issue is that, despite them getting closer in price, getting theatre tickets always feels more loaded than getting cinema tickets. I feel worse sitting through a bad play than I do going to a bad film, but then missing a movie in the cinema, you feel like you can always see it on DVD, but theatre is so fleeting. It doesn't help that I also feel guilty returning tickets...

I think there's also a 'mob mentality' to it- I often feel I'm being a 'bad' theatre person missing out on all these things at the Court, NT, or wherever. Even at home people are constantly talking about/posting on social media about you have to see x or y new play. But in all honesty there's only so many evenings a week, and we all have laundry to do sometimes and you simply can't see everything. So I've slowly been trying not to feel guilty or as if I'm missing out and going to thing I genuinely want to see! 

[Deleted]

Good question! Like others, I go on writer, director, cast, maybe hunt out reviews of the writer's previous work if I've not seen it. Also whether I trust the theatre to be consistent (e.g Almeida, Royal Court, Young Vic, not Hampstead or Old Vic). Plus for booking early rather than hanging on for reviews - will it sell out? Are there bargain seats you can get by booking early (eg Old Vic, Almeida) or a season multi-buy discount (eg Royal Court, Young Vic). And are the tickets returnable for credit if I change my mind (eg Barbican, National, RSC)? Not something to feel guilty about, you've basically lent them some money for a few months and they've probably charged you a couple of quid for the privilege

[kathryn]

Price is definitely a factor. I'm willing to give most stuff a punt for a tenner, especially if the cast or creatives interest me. And it can be truly exciting to see something knowing nothing about it - when it turns out to be good it's simply glorious! There are times I will avoid reviews of shows I have already booked for do I get that fresh experience.

That's relatively rare, though - I think we all do the theatrical equivalent of kissing a lot of frogs!

However, when it's costing you more you really do want to be fairly sure you'll like it.

And I wouldn't be a regular theatre-goer at all if I didn't work in London, let alone willing to risk a totally unknown quantity.

[martin1965]

Jun 6, 2017 16:50:31 GMT @emicardiff said:

Jun 6, 2017 16:31:06 GMT jadnoop said:

Thanks for all of the comments. It's reassuring to hear that it's not simply down to some secret fountain of theatre 'new play' knowledge that I don't know about yet

I suppose part of the issue is that, despite them getting closer in price, getting theatre tickets always feels more loaded than getting cinema tickets. I feel worse sitting through a bad play than I do going to a bad film, but then missing a movie in the cinema, you feel like you can always see it on DVD, but theatre is so fleeting. It doesn't help that I also feel guilty returning tickets...

I think there's also a 'mob mentality' to it- I often feel I'm being a 'bad' theatre person missing out on all these things at the Court, NT, or wherever. Even at home people are constantly talking about/posting on social media about you have to see x or y new play. But in all honesty there's only so many evenings a week, and we all have laundry to do sometimes and you simply can't see everything. So I've slowly been trying not to feel guilty or as if I'm missing out and going to thing I genuinely want to see! 

This is precisely my point Dr Emily! You cant see something every day and neither should you. As experienced and knowledgeable theatregoers we should pick and choose☺

[Jan]

After spending most of the 1980s watching new plays I concluded by far the best course to save wasted time/money was to never go and see any ever again, a policy I have followed ever since.

[bordeaux]

Jun 7, 2017 6:30:21 GMT Jan said:

After spending most of the 1980s watching new plays I concluded by far the best course to save wasted time/money was to never go and see any ever again, a policy I have followed ever since.

Fascinating. You didn't succumb once? Not even for Arcadia, The History Boys or Cophenhagen?

[showgirl]

Thing is, new plays become old(er) plays and will be revived if any good, so then they're a safer bet. Though some revivals seem unmerited or over-frequent.

[Deleted]

Back to the original topic, announcing a new play is an art in itself. Vicky Featherstone recently said that the Royal Court is careful to reveal as little as possible so that audiences can experience the plays directly. Personally, I like to know the flavour of a show, which is why I choose to see things on the basis of the director or sometimes writer. I always feel guilty about going to see something mainly to see an actor because this seems so trivial and a distraction from the essence of the show. Although sometimes the actor is a key flavour, as with Kathryn Hunter or, in the past, Tilda Swinton or Neil Bartlett.

[Jan]

Jun 7, 2017 6:53:40 GMT bordeaux said:

Jun 7, 2017 6:30:21 GMT Jan said:

After spending most of the 1980s watching new plays I concluded by far the best course to save wasted time/money was to never go and see any ever again, a policy I have followed ever since.

Fascinating. You didn't succumb once? Not even for Arcadia, The History Boys or Cophenhagen?

The last unarguably new play I saw was Enron in 2009 which I only went to because I liked Rupert Goold as a director and it had had good reviews - I was disappointed in it. Before that the last one which was unarguably new was Across Oka by Robert Holman in 1988. There are three that you could argue about, Speed the Plow in 1988 at NT which had already run in USA, Ideomenus at The Gate in 2012 (a very good pastiche of an ancient Greek play that had run in Germany before), and Title and Deed at the Print Room in 2012 which had run in USA. But that's it. 

No doubt I missed some very good things - maybe those you mention - but I also missed some stinkers and I've seen many hundreds of revivals in the same period.