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Post by kate8 on Jun 6, 2024 9:24:03 GMT
Well thank goodness my credit card is clear. I love, love, love this show. I wonder if Fiennes will be Gareth again and if other cast members will return? One thing I was thinking, it could all go horribly wrong if England are kicked out of the Euros early. There won’t be much in the next chapter except perhaps Gareth and his cardigan What I liked about DE was that a really entertaining and accessible play made some serious points about toxic masculinity and the state of the nation. I think that will work whatever the outcome at the Euros, whether it’s celebrating success, making terrible mistakes or doing the right thing but still failing. All of those could work for the play but losing might actually make for a more interesting and thoughtful update. |
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Post by theatremiss on Jun 6, 2024 11:27:18 GMT
Well that was painless…..apart from the credit card
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Post by theatrenerd on Jun 10, 2024 23:00:24 GMT
Do you reckon this will tour to other regional theatres or is it just a one-off run in Salford?
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Post by nash16 on Jun 10, 2024 23:47:38 GMT
Do you reckon this will tour to other regional theatres or is it just a one-off run in Salford? A lot of shows now have to go to Salford for their funding (The North: box ticked), even if they don’t stand a chance of selling. This does, thank goodness. But I’m sure it will visit other cities, especially those with big football teams. |
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Post by claireyfairy1 on Jun 14, 2024 9:17:07 GMT
Public on sale for the new run at the NT now. I got £25 front row tickets. £5 increase from last summer on those front stalls seats.
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Post by Dr Tom on Jun 14, 2024 9:35:32 GMT
Public on sale for the new run at the NT now. I got £25 front row tickets. £5 increase from last summer on those front stalls seats. Well done. I was in the queue, but by the time I got access I couldn't find any front row seats for the dates I checked. I had to resort to second and third row seats for the two viewings I've blocked in (which hopefully won't conflict with work commitments). |
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Jun 14, 2024 9:38:37 GMT
Lowry on General sale now.
Disappointing to see them offering pre-orders of six packs of beer and cider in the check out process. I hope it’s not going to attract that crowd.
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Post by Jan on Jun 14, 2024 9:49:25 GMT
Disappointing to see them offering pre-orders of six packs of beer and cider in the check out process. I hope it’s not going to attract that crowd. Ha ha. Don't worry, I doubt any hardcore England football fan will be interested in a play portraying Gareth Southgate in a positive light - they tired of him long long ago. |
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Post by amyja89 on Jun 14, 2024 9:56:29 GMT
I'm interested to see how this all turns out if the dream narrative does become a reality, especially the Jude Bellingham hype of it all. Would be a pretty mammoth reworking of the final act to do that storyline justice if Jude turns up and does the business!
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Post by zed on Jun 14, 2024 9:57:35 GMT
Public on sale for the new run at the NT now. I got £25 front row tickets. £5 increase from last summer on those front stalls seats. I was front row at Prince Edward for this show -- I loved the experience, but be aware that the stage there was very high (especially in the centre). Hopefully won't be as high in the Olivier. |
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Post by claireyfairy1 on Jun 14, 2024 10:38:07 GMT
Public on sale for the new run at the NT now. I got £25 front row tickets. £5 increase from last summer on those front stalls seats. I was front row at Prince Edward for this show -- I loved the experience, but be aware that the stage there was very high (especially in the centre). Hopefully won't be as high in the Olivier. It is often the way when things transfer into the west end alas. But saw it from the front row in the Olivier last time and it was fine. |
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Post by Jan on Jun 14, 2024 13:27:38 GMT
Just out of interest Channel 4 have commissioned James Graham to write a drama about the relationship (such as it was) between Margaret Thatcher and TV interviewer Brian Walden with Harriet Walter and Steve Coogan. Hard to see much drama in it - ex-Labour MP turns into a big fan of Thatcher. I wonder how long Graham can go on churning out fictionalised accounts of real events. Forever probably.
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Post by Jon on Jun 14, 2024 13:30:49 GMT
Just out of interest Channel 4 have commissioned James Graham to write a drama about the relationship (such as it was) between Margaret Thatcher and TV interviewer Brian Walden with Harriet Walter and Steve Coogan. Hard to see much drama in it - ex-Labour MP turns into a big fan of Thatcher. I wonder how long Graham can go on churning out fictionalised accounts of real events. Forever probably. Not all of James Graham's plays are based on real events, Labour of Love wasn't nor was The Vote or Boys from the Blackstuff to name but three example although Blackstuff is an adaptation rather than his own work. The fact James Graham is one of the successful playwrights at the moment seems to suggest his work resonates with audiences |
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Post by Jan on Jun 14, 2024 14:12:06 GMT
Just out of interest Channel 4 have commissioned James Graham to write a drama about the relationship (such as it was) between Margaret Thatcher and TV interviewer Brian Walden with Harriet Walter and Steve Coogan. Hard to see much drama in it - ex-Labour MP turns into a big fan of Thatcher. I wonder how long Graham can go on churning out fictionalised accounts of real events. Forever probably. Not all of James Graham's plays are based on real events, Him and Peter Morgan fighting it out to be the King of Faction, Jeff Pope 3rd place. |
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Post by n1david on Jun 14, 2024 14:32:28 GMT
Just out of interest Channel 4 have commissioned James Graham to write a drama about the relationship (such as it was) between Margaret Thatcher and TV interviewer Brian Walden with Harriet Walter and Steve Coogan. Hard to see much drama in it - ex-Labour MP turns into a big fan of Thatcher. I wonder how long Graham can go on churning out fictionalised accounts of real events. Forever probably. I've read the book from which the story is drawn, Rob Burley's 'Why is this Lying Bastard Lying to Me?'. The book is based around the drama of the political interview and why the demise of the long-form interview is one of the contributors to the weakening of political discourse in this country. In this case the drama comes from the fact that Walden kept it secret from his bosses that he had been advising Thatcher during the 1983 election campaign, whilst interview her and her opponents as an 'independent' journalist. Thatcher agreed to be interviewed by him in 1989 when she was having rough times and expected an easy ride. But her chancellor Nigel Lawson had resigned just a couple of days before the interview. He gave her a really difficult time in the interview, accusing her at one point of one of her backbenchers saying that she was "off her trolly". It is regarded as the beginning of the end of her career as PM. The entire interview is online here: After the interview, they never spoke again. I suspect the TV programme (two one-hour episodes) will have a lot of fun bringing the late 80s back to life, as there were a number of big political characters around then, unlike now. I think it should be an entertaining watch, especially for those of us who lived through the period. |
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Post by Jonnyboy on Jun 14, 2024 22:19:47 GMT
Public on sale for the new run at the NT now. I got £25 front row tickets. £5 increase from last summer on those front stalls seats. No such cheap seats for the Salford run. Paid £54 for front row! |
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Post by amyja89 on Jun 21, 2024 11:59:48 GMT
Enthusiasm for Southgate is arguably at an all time low right now, James Graham will have his work cut out for him with this re-write if England don’t turn up soon. 😬
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Post by NeilVHughes on Jun 30, 2024 19:37:40 GMT
Looks as if the players have got an early draft of the notes for the new ending.
Declan Rice:
‘There are players saying to each other one minute to go and there is that inner fight and spirit in us. We have got that togetherness tonight, we would do anything to protect this manager. Keep going and keep fighting, it is an honour to be a part of it – we are going to keep going”
Spoiler:
England limp through to the quarter finals but with no feelgood factor to help the Tories, after the election Southgate gets them playing brilliantly and they win the tournament and a Labour Prime Minister welcomes them back with the cup
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Post by Jan on Jun 30, 2024 20:43:52 GMT
Enthusiasm for Southgate is arguably at an all time low right now, James Graham will have his work cut out for him with this re-write if England don’t turn up soon. 😬 That’s the better ending though, Southgate leaves the team in exactly the same state they were in when he arrived: his favourites, the cliques, the players doubting the manager, the disillusioned fans, the toxic press atmosphere, the under-achievement - the cycle starts again. He’s on £5 million a year incidentally so that’s some compensation. |
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Post by theatreliker on Jul 1, 2024 9:40:42 GMT
I've been wondering how this tournament will impact the plays legacy. I imagine Graham is rewriting buts for the TV series and/or the stage return next year.
The play wasn't perfect imo with a lot crammed into the second act, as enjoyable as it was
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Post by max on Jul 1, 2024 11:27:56 GMT
It's fascinating - if they'd lost last night I think the return run might as well have been cancelled, who'd want to watch it? The result of the general election, and particularly the position of Reform may challenge the play's previous thesis.
The ending can be changed, but in the run up the whole premise is that in some way the emotional intelligence Southgate brought to the England team seeped by osmosis into the nation itself. I didn't buy the play's idea that the support after Kane's missed World Cup 2022 penalty showed a maturing in the country, compared to the reception the young Black players had got on missing penalties at the Euros 2020 . Um...anyone spot a difference between them and Kane? I couldn't respect Graham failing to raise that point - perhaps via one of the Black players, and Graham has done 'choose your ending' before to good effect in 'Quiz'. This would be more 'choose your takeaway message, but be aware it is a choice'.
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Post by aspieandy on Jul 1, 2024 11:39:16 GMT
I didn't buy the play's idea that the support after Kane's missed penalty showed a maturing in the country, compared to the reception the young Black players had got on missing penalties at a previous point.
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Post by max on Jul 1, 2024 11:53:57 GMT
I didn't buy the play's idea that the support after Kane's missed penalty showed a maturing in the country, compared to the reception the young Black players had got on missing penalties at a previous point.
Thanks aspieandy I hadn't seen your post on that subject before, re. the possibility/discovery (based on research) that a lot of the online abuse of Black players was from bot farms, designed to divide people. Interesting, and in itself worth inclusion in the updated play. My default (rightly or wrongly) has been to believe that online racism is true/real, as I've got involved with closing down some definitely real far right racists whose violent and graphic description of Black people was beyond belief. One was an actor, who said "we need more Stephen Lawrences" (amongst scores of other things I can't put here). Well...he doesn't have any agent any more. But I'm not citing that to dispute what you say about bots - so thanks for that perspective. Whatever the truth, it was an extraordinary pressure Southgate put on those young Black players - if I remember rightly some were only on the field as very late substitutes to be available in the event of penalties. If I was him I must admit I don't think I'd have been so colour blind, with their reception in mind. |
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Post by aspieandy on Jul 1, 2024 13:18:22 GMT
Whatever the truth, it was an extraordinary pressure Southgate put on those young Black players - if I remember rightly some were only on the field as very late substitutes to be available in the event of penalties. If I was him I must admit I don't think I'd have been so colour blind, with their reception in mind. The play, in part, describes the steps the FA took as a result of prevous tournament failures. The squad had been together for 4 weeks. Decisions about penalties had long since been made. Plenty of senior players hid from taking penalties including, if pigment is important, Raheem Sterling. You can only conclude the squad was content for the three youngsters to bear the responsibility (rather than themselves).
On the question of bots, ignoring troll farms served centrsit mainstream media's agenda, after the referendum, of painting the country as a horrible racist place. Doing Putin's work for him, if you will. Tbh, US media paid more attention because of the election interference narrative. They did produce some outstanging graphics to help descrive the processes.
The comments in this youtube vid are sobering. If you have time, and as a single example, do scroll through the comment section here. Witthout doubt now, we know this approach to hijacking public sentiment has had a dramatic effect on aspects of society - all of this derived from 34 UK-based comments on social media from drunks and idiots :
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Post by max on Jul 1, 2024 14:13:32 GMT
Whatever the truth, it was an extraordinary pressure Southgate put on those young Black players - if I remember rightly some were only on the field as very late substitutes to be available in the event of penalties. If I was him I must admit I don't think I'd have been so colour blind, with their reception in mind. The play, in part, describes the steps the FA took as a result of prevous tournament failures. The squad had been together for 4 weeks. Decisions about penalties had long since been made. Plenty of senior players hid from taking penalties including, if pigment is important, Raheem Sterling. You can only conclude the squad was content for the three youngsters to bear the responsibility (rather than themselves).
On the question of bots, ignoring troll farms served centrsit mainstream media's agenda, after the referendum, of painting the country as a horrible racist place. Doing Putin's work for him, if you will. Tbh, US media paid more attention because of the election interference narrative. They did produce some outstanging graphics to help descrive the processes.
The comments in this youtube vid are sobering. If you have time, and as a single example, do scroll through the comment section here. Witthout doubt now, we know this approach to hijacking public sentiment has had a dramatic effect on aspects of society - all of this derived from 34 UK-based comments on social media from drunks and idiots :
Hijacking public sentiment is also lucrative - perpetrated by real people in the UK, not bots: divisive youtubers and various goading grifters where hate-harvesting and angertainment are easy money. I've seen enough municipal theatres selling opportunities to see these 'heroes' in person and selling very well. This was particularly in the period when the captive audience (hooked during lockdown), finally became the live audience seeing their leader at the local civic theatre . Like any theatre audience, the sold out crowd is a tiny proportion of the country, but I saw one UK youtuber grow their online following massively over a year based on homophobic, transphobic and anti muslim hate, as well as mocking autism, and goading people to hang themselves. He said "My plan is to be so big I become untouchable". Backed by a Tory MP when things got hot for him, it worked for a while, though he's in jail now. Google still haven't taken his youtube channel down. I highly suspect most of his output was a performed act for ££ rather than from deep-seated belief, but the results can be just as dangerous, if a follower is stirred up to act against the object of hate that's been set up. One of his followers made a video celebrating the stabbing of David Ames MP. The actual flesh and blood people that turned out to see him in theatres definitely made those theatres "a horrible racist place". That's another James Graham play perhaps. Sorry to take us so far off track of the play 'Dear England', but though I accept what you say about bots, I've also seen the parts of the UK that are kept on simmer by these grifters to be a "horrible racist place" so I can't dismiss things I've observed, or that I've experienced personally myself. |
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