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Post by steve10086 on Dec 5, 2017 20:33:43 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2017 20:36:49 GMT
It may be false, it may be true . . . |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2017 21:18:15 GMT
Sad news.
Though reading that makes me realise what a great subject it is for a musical. Should have done better. No doubt will re-emerge at some point after a few re-writes!
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Post by Mr Snow on Dec 6, 2017 6:46:50 GMT
It may be false, it may be true . . . You would say that... |
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Post by martin1965 on Dec 6, 2017 7:14:52 GMT
Not sure why this is receiving so much coverage, yes it was a big scandal but you would have to be in your 60s to recall it.
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Post by musicalmarge on Dec 6, 2017 7:45:46 GMT
Not sure why this is receiving so much coverage, yes it was a big scandal but you would have to be in your 60s to recall it. Maybe some people are educated and have a vast interest, knowledge and understanding in British politics and history? I wasn’t born then and knew the whole story - a visit to the glorious Cliveden House owned by the National Trust helps. Wonderful place. |
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Dec 6, 2017 8:12:24 GMT
ALW should have written a musical called Mandy! (with exclamation point). It would have been a sure fire hit.
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Post by Stephen on Dec 6, 2017 8:18:06 GMT
I wish I’d seen it. I do mostly enjoy the cast recording as I like Alexander Hanson. I love the lyric “I will miss the softness of skin. That moment when conversations begin.”
If this returns I’d definitely see it. Charing Cross theatre?
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Post by martin1965 on Dec 6, 2017 12:16:05 GMT
Not sure why this is receiving so much coverage, yes it was a big scandal but you would have to be in your 60s to recall it. Maybe some people are educated and have a vast interest, knowledge and understanding in British politics and history? I wasn’t born then and knew the whole story - a visit to the glorious Cliveden House owned by the National Trust helps. Wonderful place. I wasnt born then either but am aware of it. |
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Post by steve10086 on Dec 6, 2017 12:39:30 GMT
Not sure why this is receiving so much coverage, yes it was a big scandal but you would have to be in your 60s to recall it. Do you have a particular cut off point when you think things should or should not be reported about? 1980? 2015? |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2017 12:45:48 GMT
I expect, 1965.
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Dec 6, 2017 13:14:41 GMT
ALW should have written a musical called Mandy! (with exclamation point). It would have been a sure fire hit. Oh yes, she came and she gave without taking, but he sent her away... Ooh you ARE awful.... |
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Post by Mr Snow on Dec 6, 2017 13:33:57 GMT
It really was one of those moments that signified changing times.
Then there’s the Christine Keeler F+++++! us all, theory. This explains modern British politics as follows. As each election came along the Conservative Party would promise to run a tight ship, cut taxes and spend a bit more on the police and defence. Labour would counter by promising to spend wisely, with a bit more for the NHS and pay for it with higher taxes on the rich. Governments changed, but post war the National Debt as a proportion of GDP routinely fell.
When the Profumo affair broke the elderly MacMillan saw an election disaster looming and in desperation promised to keep taxes as they were, but spend more for the benefit of each of the electorate “You’ve never had it so good”. This left Labour at a loss and so they promised to spend even more on each of us. This spending “Arms race” has continued ever since and we have been running at a deficit for more years than not.
(This is how it was explained to me and yes I recognise that the man gets off scot free).
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Post by distantcousin on Dec 6, 2017 15:32:39 GMT
Not sure why this is receiving so much coverage, yes it was a big scandal but you would have to be in your 60s to recall it. The baby boomer generation are influential and powerful in this country, such are their numbers - and this was an era that they very much remember. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 19, 2020 12:39:49 GMT
I have been watching the Sunday night Trial of Christine Keeler drama on BBC1, which for obvious reasons has reminded me hugely of this musical.
It had an astonishingly short run for an ALW musical, his shorter ever (less than 4 months) for what was planned as an open ended run, bar perhaps Jeeves in the 1970s. I went many times and it was often half empty so really did fail massively at the box office.
Bizarrely though I do think that makes it a curious oddity that I am very happy to have seen. Must say I doubt it will ever be staged in a main West End house again. Though I do really hope there will be some kind of revival at some point.
It is underrated as far as ALW shows go, but no doubt problematic. The second half I do find slightly tedious, particularly the newspaper, police interview and trial scenes which work neither dramatically or musically. I am not sure how it could be reworked as guess that WAS the story.
Musically it also has the problem which much of the latter ALW stuff has had of inconsistency. To my taste there are some stunning ALW melodies up there with his best (This Side Of The Sky, Too Close To The Flame, You've Never Had It So Good, I'm Hopeless When It Comes To You, Love Nest, 1963) but also some that I really didn't like (Black Hearted Woman, Mother Russia - slightly lazy pastiche that doesn't really work - and the never ending interview/trial bits).
Production wise I do think it had a cheap and rather visually unappealing set (ironic as ALW himself is always saying you can't love a musical that you can't love LOOKING at). Having said that, of course the subject matter does not command a spectacular set. That does make me think it would work better in a small venue with minimal set rather than unattractive set.
As for the story I am not (quite) old enough to remember it but I do find it fascinating. Having said that, it has no appeal to tourists and really doesn't have anything for the younger Jamie/Evan Hansen/Waitress generation. So it can never have mass appeal.
But there is a great show in there and I hope it will one day come to light.
Just some random Sunday thoughts....
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Jan 19, 2020 14:41:01 GMT
Merged
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Post by horton on Jan 19, 2020 14:57:36 GMT
It was so thoroughly lacking in drama or tension. One of the worst musicals I have ever seen. Really.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 19, 2020 16:14:35 GMT
I'm quite enjoying the BBC drama and I too thought about the musical (although I never saw it). Stephen Ward in the drama feels like the centre of the story, but I think that might be James Nortons performance rather than anything. For me part of the problem is none of the characters are particularly sympathetic, and in this day and age it really isnt all that shocking so it's really hard to get across the impact it had at the time. I also think the name of the musical was a bad choice.
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Post by danb on Jan 19, 2020 22:02:28 GMT
Mandy Rice Davies used to be my landlady...
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Post by Deleted on Jan 19, 2020 22:29:56 GMT
Musically it also has the problem which much of the latter ALW stuff has had of inconsistency. To my taste there are some stunning ALW melodies up there with his best (This Side Of The Sky, Too Close To The Flame, You've Never Had It So Good, I'm Hopeless When It Comes To You, Love Nest, 1963) but also some that I really didn't like (Black Hearted Woman, Mother Russia - slightly lazy pastiche that doesn't really work - and the never ending interview/trial bits). Totally agree. Some beautiful melodies, but the rest? yikes. I think i only have about 4 or 5 songs from it downloaded. If it eventually gets revived, they need to work out the second half. Trials are not interesting enough to sing about. It definitely dragged in the Aldwych production. Also, i wasn't invested enough in the characters to care, or they had no impact on the story. Joanna Riding was sorely wasted in this. In the first half, i swear the only thing she did was walk across the stage and then got the big ballad in the second half. But why? we knew absolutely nothing about her character and now we're expected to care? I wonder if she knew that all the part was when offered.. Still i'm sure she got a good salary for a walk on part. |
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Post by anita on Jan 20, 2020 10:01:16 GMT
I saw it & have said I remember my parents discussing the story at the time. The trouble was the characters weren't likeable & the musical was biased in that ALW felt Stephen Ward was innocent.
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Post by tysilio2 on Jan 20, 2020 10:29:25 GMT
Mandy Rice Davies used to be my landlady... That sounds like you're auditioning for 'Would I Lie To You' |
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Post by danb on Jan 20, 2020 10:37:52 GMT
Mandy Rice Davies used to be my landlady... That sounds like you're auditioning for 'Would I Lie To You' Never met her...she was just a name on the paperwork 😀 |
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Post by steve10086 on Jan 20, 2020 10:58:46 GMT
I saw it & have said I remember my parents discussing the story at the time. The trouble was the characters weren't likeable & the musical was biased in that ALW felt Stephen Ward was innocent. Mainly because he was innocent. |
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Post by chernjam on Jan 21, 2020 5:05:26 GMT
this was probably the most niche thing that ALW had ever written. Here he's a global phenomenon - and he goes after a topic that only (from your reports) people over 45 in the UK would know.
Not impossible to make commercially viable elsewhere. Im sure Eva Peron was not a globally recognizable name. But as an avid ALW fan who pre-orders releases of any music I was bored with it. Score wise the theme song was intriguing. Hopeless when it comes to you is one of the finest lyrics/melodies that sounds emotionally wrenching and impactful (but from reports of the show is a secondary aspect of the whole story) other side of sky was a nice melody. "Never had it so good" - memorable but not my speed... seems pandering to an audience wanting some risque stuff.
Intriguing and cool to see ALW take a gamble on something he was passionate about even if it didn't work
Did anyone here see the "revival" he staged at the Other Palace which was a reworking of it? Just curious that he was that passionate about it that he kept working on it.
Speaking of - it kills me they didn't record the "revival" of The Woman in white. Thoroughly enjoyed that and would've loved to have seen (or at least heard) it
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