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Post by couldileaveyou on May 17, 2019 11:13:58 GMT
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Post by basdfg on May 17, 2019 11:15:54 GMT
And if everyone does the show closes. I think you'll find the people who stay at home will be the minority. Most people have more sense. His prerogative of course, but that sort of attitude is thankfully not going to be held by enough people to cause any damage to the show at all - Les Mis has had ethnic minority actors playing leading roles and funnily enough no-one batted an eyelid. His rants scare me at time. And it will of course be more who has to put up with it. His Paranoia and anger is unbearable at times. |
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Post by Oleanna on May 17, 2019 11:18:47 GMT
I think you'll find the people who stay at home will be the minority. Most people have more sense. His prerogative of course, but that sort of attitude is thankfully not going to be held by enough people to cause any damage to the show at all - Les Mis has had ethnic minority actors playing leading roles and funnily enough no-one batted an eyelid. His rants scare me at time. And it will of course be more who has to put up with it. I have sympathy for your situation basdfg, after all, our parents are the most influential people in our lives. All I can say is I really hope you have opportunities to form your own opinions, views and passions, away from what your parents think and feel. |
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Post by theatrenewbie on May 17, 2019 11:19:57 GMT
I actually did mention the amira okereke whos going to play Laurey in Oklahoma as an good candidate for my fair lady, but obviously that post got overlooked.
I think it would add a really interesting second level, seeing her develop through the show.
I like colour blind casting when it works. What people need to remember we are watching a musical where a whole town square doesn’t bust into a ten min dance break or In a middle of a fight we break out into a power ballad.
Taking a leap of faith and imagination will kinda help you over come someone’s colour...which shouldn’t matter anyway.
Colour blind casting isn’t just shoving a in black person in a show and saying great filled the quota.
And it’s no good saying well we have Tina, Mormon, dreamgirls theu are “race specific shows” where if I was black I wouldn’t be offended if I wasn’t up for Tracey turnblad if auditioning for hairspray, as the whole background is racial divide.
But my fair lady doesn’t state or nor claim Eliza is white or black just explains her age physical appearance but not race! Just the same with hermione and maybe 50% of other leading lady roles which don’t specifically relate to race (ie- Effie)
And no I’m not triggered would just like to set some facts straight with people who maybe a little naive about this issue
Until it’s equal playing field in representation in shows for All races then w’ell never have a white Mandela.
So you can run and tell that 😂😉
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Post by basdfg on May 17, 2019 11:26:26 GMT
I actually did mention the amira okereke whos going to play Laurey in Oklahoma as an good candidate for my fair lady, but obviously that post got overlooked. I think it would add a really interesting second level, seeing her develop through the show. I like colour blind casting when it works. What people need to remember we are watching a musical where a whole town square doesn’t bust into a ten min dance break or In a middle of a fight we break out into a power ballad. Taking a leap of faith and imagination will kinda help you over come someone’s colour...which shouldn’t matter anyway. Colour blind casting isn’t just shoving a in black person in a show and saying great filled the quota. And it’s no good saying well we have Tina, Mormon, dreamgirls theu are “race specific shows” where if I was black I wouldn’t be offended if I wasn’t up for Tracey turnblad if auditioning for hairspray, as the whole background is racial divide. But my fair lady doesn’t state or nor claim Eliza is white or black just explains her age physical appearance but not race! Just the same with hermione and maybe 50% of other leading lady roles which don’t specifically relate to race (ie- Effie) And no I’m not triggered would just like to set some facts straight with people who maybe a little naive about this issue Until it’s equal playing field in representation in shows for All races then w’ell never have a white Mandela. So you can run and tell that 😂😉 Dreamgirls is a show where race is a key underlying theme and the characters are semi based on real people anyway.
Showboat is an intresting one - Julie is mixed race but is sometimes played by white actress and other times by actress who are clearly mixed race when it's supposed to be something only her and Steve know. The Audience ignoring it theory doesn't work for Showboat because race is one of themes of the show.
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Post by princeton on May 17, 2019 11:27:50 GMT
since when was Eliza black? Since when was fictional character Eliza Doolittle white? In Pygmalion Shaw makes specific reference to where she was born and what she is wearing - but not her ethnicity. In the script for My Fair Lady she is described as follows: "She is a flower girl, Eliza Doolittle. Her basket of flowers has been knocked from her hands and her violets scattered about. She is not at all an attractive person. She is perhaps eighteen, perhaps twenty, hardly older. She wears a little sailor hat of black straw that has long been exposed to the dust and soot of London and has seldom if ever been brushed. Her hair needs washing rather badly; its mousy colour can hardly be natural. She wears a shoddy shawl, a dirty blouse with a coarse apron. Her boots are much the worse for wear. She is no doubt as clean as she can afford to be; but compared to the ladies she is very dirty. Her features are no worse than theirs; but their condition leave something to be desired, and she needs the services of a dentist" BTW Cush Jumbo was a magnificent Eliza in Pygmalion at the Royal Exchange in Manchester a few years ago |
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Post by couldileaveyou on May 17, 2019 11:30:30 GMT
A recent Off Broadway revival of Pygmalion had an Indian actress playing Eliza, which is really a wonderful idea that adds the theme of imperialism and immigration to the piece. I'm sure it would work equally well with My Fair Lady, especially since most of the time talking about diversity is reduced to some sort of black/white dichotomy, which is really not the case. Bend It Like Beckham had a great cast, but it doesn't look like there are many possibilities for Southern-Asian (or just Asian) actors in the West End.
That said, Bartlett Sher is a wonderful director, but not a revolutionary one. You'll get your white Eliza.
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2019 11:36:20 GMT
I'm sadly sure they'll cast Sheridan Smith There’s no way I can imagine her being able to sing it properly. Act it, maybe but that’s not good enough on its own. Didn’t stop Josie Rourke casting Anne Marie Duff. |
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Post by theatrenewbie on May 17, 2019 11:36:26 GMT
I actually did mention the amira okereke whos going to play Laurey in Oklahoma as an good candidate for my fair lady, but obviously that post got overlooked. I think it would add a really interesting second level, seeing her develop through the show. I like colour blind casting when it works. What people need to remember we are watching a musical where a whole town square doesn’t bust into a ten min dance break or In a middle of a fight we break out into a power ballad. Taking a leap of faith and imagination will kinda help you over come someone’s colour...which shouldn’t matter anyway. Colour blind casting isn’t just shoving a in black person in a show and saying great filled the quota. And it’s no good saying well we have Tina, Mormon, dreamgirls theu are “race specific shows” where if I was black I wouldn’t be offended if I wasn’t up for Tracey turnblad if auditioning for hairspray, as the whole background is racial divide. But my fair lady doesn’t state or nor claim Eliza is white or black just explains her age physical appearance but not race! Just the same with hermione and maybe 50% of other leading lady roles which don’t specifically relate to race (ie- Effie) And no I’m not triggered would just like to set some facts straight with people who maybe a little naive about this issue Until it’s equal playing field in representation in shows for All races then w’ell never have a white Mandela. So you can run and tell that 😂😉 Dreamgirls is a show where race is a key underlying theme and the characters are semi based on real people anyway.
Showboat is an intresting one - Julie is mixed race but is sometimes played by white actress and other times by actress who are clearly mixed race when it's supposed to be something only her and Steve know.
That’s nice, totally understand your point. I only mentioned Effie as in my “humble eyes” it’s imperative you have black girl playing that role. . But I’d like to talk about and not brush over is “white roles” not ambiguous ethnicities or semi biographical roles. I’m not just alluding them to be played by black people, all races need representation in this white dominated world. Let me think of better ideas and you can let me know your thoughts Anna - king and I Christine daae - specifically played by black lady (yes I know the book states she’s from Sweden or something. Julie Jordan Not trying to start a fight but food for thought. |
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Post by basdfg on May 17, 2019 11:38:24 GMT
A recent Off Broadway revival of Pygmalion had an Indian actress playing Eliza, which is really a wonderful idea that adds the theme of imperialism and immigration to the piece. I'm sure it would work equally well with My Fair Lady, especially since most of the time talking about diversity is reduced to some sort of black/white dichotomy, which is really not the case. Bend It Like Beckham had a great cast, but it doesn't look like there are many possibilities for Southern-Asian (or just Asian) actors in the West End. That said, Bartlett Sher is a wonderful director, but not a revolutionary one. You'll get your white Eliza. A mixed race Eliza would probably be the first step - like how Nancy has had many mixed race portrayals but not as many actress of full black heritage. Quite possibly racism there - light skinned people of colour being seen as more acceptable for originally white roles than darker skinned ones.
Did the play make reference to Eliza having Indian roots or was the script and actions the same as if she was white. The first is more revolutionary than the second because race and racism is actually explored rather than just being ignored.
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Post by Jon on May 17, 2019 12:08:47 GMT
Funny enough, I was wondering about colour-blind casting last night too. I don't see it would be an issue. There were certainly black people in all classes in London at the time the show was set. That we whitewashed them out of history books so the fact wasn't recognised is the actual issue at stake, I feel. Colour blind casting is certainly present in this production as both actors who played Freddy were both black. |
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2019 12:18:29 GMT
A mixed race Eliza would probably be the first step This very Broadway production has already had that - the second understudy, Shereen Ahmed, who went on for Eliza a couple of weeks ago. I don't think colour-blind casting for here is beyond the realms of possibility at all. |
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Post by Phantom of London on May 17, 2019 12:46:59 GMT
Can the producers not go with a Companyesque approach instead.
With Eliza, use gender blind casting? So have a man that sells flowers in Covent Garden instead?
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Post by oxfordsimon on May 17, 2019 13:05:29 GMT
With Shaw falling out of copyright next year, I can see a number of new interpretations of his plays heading to the stage. A Pygmalion with a male Eliza could certainly work - why not also throw in a female Higgins and explore things the other way round?
Probably easier to do it with the play as you don't need to consider adapting the musical score.
As with many things derived from Greek myths, you can often find a lot of freedom to change things up.
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Post by Jon on May 17, 2019 13:08:19 GMT
With Shaw falling out of copyright next year, I can see a number of new interpretations of his plays heading to the stage. A Pygmalion with a male Eliza could certainly work - why not also throw in a female Higgins and explore things the other way round? Probably easier to do it with the play as you don't need to consider adapting the musical score. As with many things derived from Greek myths, you can often find a lot of freedom to change things up. It’s sort of surprising a gender swapped Pygmalion has never been done already. |
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Post by oxfordsimon on May 17, 2019 13:13:07 GMT
With Shaw falling out of copyright next year, I can see a number of new interpretations of his plays heading to the stage. A Pygmalion with a male Eliza could certainly work - why not also throw in a female Higgins and explore things the other way round? Probably easier to do it with the play as you don't need to consider adapting the musical score. As with many things derived from Greek myths, you can often find a lot of freedom to change things up. It’s sort of surprising a gender swapped Pygmalion has never been done already. It has been tried (well sort of) - but not very well if this review is to be believed www.thereviewshub.com/pygmalion-theatre-54-new-york/ |
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Post by learfan on May 17, 2019 18:23:31 GMT
With Shaw falling out of copyright next year, I can see a number of new interpretations of his plays heading to the stage. A Pygmalion with a male Eliza could certainly work - why not also throw in a female Higgins and explore things the other way round? Probably easier to do it with the play as you don't need to consider adapting the musical score. As with many things derived from Greek myths, you can often find a lot of freedom to change things up. Looking forward to some forthcoming announcements of the rarer done works. The Orange Tree must be due shortly. |
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Post by basdfg on May 17, 2019 18:52:13 GMT
A mixed race Eliza would probably be the first step This very Broadway production has already had that - the second understudy, Shereen Ahmed, who went on for Eliza a couple of weeks ago. I don't think colour-blind casting for here is beyond the realms of possibility at all.
If they going for a late 30's Eliza, Cat Simmons from Come From Away could be a candidate.
My Fair Lady would be very hard to adapt the score to gender reverse.
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Post by basdfg on May 17, 2019 18:57:08 GMT
Funny enough, I was wondering about colour-blind casting last night too. I don't see it would be an issue. There were certainly black people in all classes in London at the time the show was set. That we whitewashed them out of history books so the fact wasn't recognised is the actual issue at stake, I feel. Colour blind casting is certainly present in this production as both actors who played Freddy were both black. Is it true colour blind (when everyone is looked at for the role) Or are only black actors looked at for the role (so the role is considered Black for casting purposes).
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Post by paulbrownsey on May 17, 2019 20:59:17 GMT
"Let me think of better ideas and you can let me know your thoughts
Anna - king and I
Christine daae - specifically played by black lady (yes I know the book states she’s from Sweden or something.
Julie Jordan"
Not trying to start a fight but food for thought."
According to the intro to my edition of The English Governess At the Siamese Court, the real Anna may have been mixed-race.
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Post by theatrenewbie on May 17, 2019 22:44:04 GMT
"Let me think of better ideas and you can let me know your thoughts Anna - king and I Christine daae - specifically played by black lady (yes I know the book states she’s from Sweden or something. Julie Jordan" Not trying to start a fight but food for thought." According to the intro to my edition of The English Governess At the Siamese Court, the real Anna may have been mixed-race. My point entirely RE anna . |
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Post by theatrefan77 on May 17, 2019 22:51:30 GMT
Can we go back to Eliza please? Would love to hear more suggestions
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Post by ahbutunderneath on May 18, 2019 7:06:14 GMT
I find it funny how historical accuracy is always brought up in regards to colorblind casting and not nearly as frequently to anachronistic or historically inaccurate pieces of theatre.
Getting back to Eliza, I want a younger, more unknown actress. Though not very ‘unknown’, Daisy Maywood has a gorgeous voice and I’ve really liked her versatility. Miriam Teak-Lee is a real unknown who would knock this role out of the park with the amount of talent she has.
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Post by Oleanna on May 18, 2019 7:38:15 GMT
I find it funny how historical accuracy is always brought up in regards to colorblind casting and not nearly as frequently to anachronistic or historically inaccurate pieces of theatre. Getting back to Eliza, I want a younger, more unknown actress. Though not very ‘unknown’, Daisy Maywood has a gorgeous voice and I’ve really liked her versatility. Miriam Teak-Lee is a real unknown who would knock this role out of the park with the amount of talent she has. Yes to both of those! Would love to see Dean John-Wilson as Freddy Eynsford-Hill. Not just because they’re both hyphenates. |
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2019 10:48:56 GMT
I find it funny how historical accuracy is always brought up in regards to colorblind casting and not nearly as frequently to anachronistic or historically inaccurate pieces of theatre. Getting back to Eliza, I want a younger, more unknown actress. Though not very ‘unknown’, Daisy Maywood has a gorgeous voice and I’ve really liked her versatility. Miriam Teak-Lee is a real unknown who would knock this role out of the park with the amount of talent she has. Yes to both of those! Would love to see Dean John-Wilson as Freddy Eynsford-Hill. Not just because they’re both hyphenates. No, no, that would never work. How can you show off your pecs in a tuxedo? |
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