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Post by tributary on Sept 14, 2017 21:58:42 GMT
I'll just leave my regular post in threads about Rufus Norris being a disaster pointing out that Angels was a sell-out, and Follies, Mosquitoes and Oslo are largely sold out, and Network is largely sold out. Not sure that Hytner or other predecessors did better than that in any given period. In response to the predicted response saying he wasn't responsible for all these - you can't blame him for everything that doesn't work, and refuse to give him credit for anything that does work. That's not true. Oslo isn't selling well at all - I was there last night and it was visibly less than half full. |
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Post by oxfordsimon on Sept 14, 2017 22:02:26 GMT
Norris will serve out the length of his contract. No major company is going to risk dismissing an Artistic Director for anything other than gross misconduct.
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Post by n1david on Sept 14, 2017 22:18:31 GMT
Norris will serve out the length of his contract. No major company is going to risk dismissing an Artistic Director for anything other than gross misconduct. <cough> Emma Rice. |
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Post by oxfordsimon on Sept 14, 2017 22:20:46 GMT
Precisely. The National isn't going to want that sort of publicity/backlash
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2017 6:13:35 GMT
That's not true. Oslo isn't selling well at all - I was there last night and it was visibly less than half full. It is true - check the website. Every performance is either sold out or has one or two seats left. No idea why it would be half full last night - some weirdness about press nights? Also he will serve out the length of his contract has he has had a couple of flops, as has every other AD of the National, but is generally quite succesful. All these people going on about the "failing National Theatre" sound increasingly like Donald Trump going on about the "failing New York Times" |
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Post by horton on Sept 15, 2017 17:28:33 GMT
Do we all have to put up our academic qualifications now?
Should we also include our current bank balance?
(PS I do mean this light-heartedly!)
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Post by Jon on Sept 15, 2017 17:35:07 GMT
It is true - check the website. Every performance is either sold out or has one or two seats left. No idea why it would be half full last night - some weirdness about press nights? It was practically sold out last Saturday so unless it's been comped heavily then I'm not buying it's not selling well at least for the National run |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2017 19:09:10 GMT
Do we all have to put up our academic qualifications now?Should we also include our current bank balance? (PS I do mean this light-heartedly!) I was wondering that. When did all this start? |
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751 posts
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Post by horton on Sept 16, 2017 7:40:21 GMT
That's very impressive and persuasive- though measuring the distance in yards does date you rather.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2017 8:21:47 GMT
Not persuasive enough it turns out. I've been trying to get Rufus to follow up Pinocchio with The Little Mermaid for next year's Christmas show at the Nash, taking on Yours Truly as stage swimming consultant. I told him it'd guarantee him another year at least. He's having none of it. It was the same when I approached Titanic. A flat no.
Age and experience count for nothing nowadays...
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Post by rumbledoll on Sept 16, 2017 8:43:23 GMT
As a side note: anybody knows where the hell the new season is going to be announced? Things used to be more structural and in control.. I mean by this time each year the press-conference'd be called and we'd know already, what the upcoming year brings..
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Post by crowblack on Sept 16, 2017 9:00:23 GMT
Macbeth with Anne-Marie Duff and Rory Kinnear and a production of Annie Baker's John were mentioned a few months ago.
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Post by rumbledoll on Sept 16, 2017 9:16:15 GMT
Macbeth with Anne-Marie Duff and Rory Kinnear and a production of Annie Baker's John were mentioned a few months ago.
As well as Anthony and Cleopatra in Summer, yes.. But I'm talking details.. dates... and there's still a lot to come across three theatres I guess..
Also recently it's been a weird thing with NT website.. No casting shown for the productions that's due while the cast is already announced.. you can find it anywhere but the exact place it should officially be... Or AiA dedicated page saying Part II is approx 3h30min for months before they changed it to the correct running time..
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Post by zahidf on Sept 16, 2017 9:17:22 GMT
Macbeth with Anne-Marie Duff and Rory Kinnear and a production of Annie Baker's John were mentioned a few months ago.
As well as Anthony and Cleopatra in Summer, yes.. But I'm talking details.. dates... and there's still a lot to come across three theatres I guess..
Also recently it's been a weird thing with NT website.. No casting shown for the productions that's due while the cast is already announced.. you can find it anywhere but the exact place it should officially be... Or AiA dedicated page saying Part II is approx 3h30min for months before they changed it to the correct running time..
Its booked up until next Feb isnt it? I imagine theyll be one more booking period for new shows end of October |
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Post by martin1965 on Sept 16, 2017 10:26:04 GMT
Yep, sometime next month for an announcement prob upto April/May.
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Post by dave72 on Sept 16, 2017 16:11:42 GMT
But nothing has been announced for the Dorfman after 9 January, right?
And yes, rumbledoll, you're right about the website. For instance, it continues to say Amadeus returns "from 22 January" even though it was pushed back to January 11th weeks ago.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2017 16:15:40 GMT
But nothing has been announced for the Dorfman after 9 January, right? Not on-sale, but the next two plays were announced months ago: The Great Wave and John. |
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Post by dave72 on Sept 18, 2017 16:20:24 GMT
Not on-sale, but the next two plays were announced months ago: The Great Wave and John. Thanks. Yes, I knew that--I just didn't think either was planned for as early as January. |
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Post by bordeaux on Sept 24, 2017 10:20:55 GMT
I went to Oslo yesterday afternoon and Mosquitoes in the evening, both greeted with passionate applause. Follies was on next door. No sign of a theatre in crisis there.
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Post by Jan on Sept 24, 2017 15:19:33 GMT
I went to Oslo yesterday afternoon and Mosquitoes in the evening, both greeted with passionate applause. Follies was on next door. No sign of a theatre in crisis there. The crisis, or problem at least, is artistic - two new plays and an American musical is very narrow programming and it's set to continue - of course I understand that if you happen to like that it's fine but you can't project your own tastes on to the rest of us. Whether there's a financial crisis is hard to say - time will tell. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2017 17:42:45 GMT
Yes -- or to phrase the problem another way, he's now coming up three years in (started March 2015) A What are the huge, industry-shaking successes? B Who are the major defining artists whose home is his regime at that building? To give you two comparisons on the same time scale Hytner started April 2003. So by October 2005 A Jerry Springer The Opera, History Boys, Dark Matrrials, Elmina's Kitchen, The Pillowman, Complicite Measure for Measure, Stuff Happens B Katie Mitchell, Marianne Elliot, David Hare, Simon McBurney, Howard Davies, Kwame Kwei-Armah, Alan Bennett Goold started at the Almieda October 2013. So by May 2016 A Chimerica, Ghosts with Lesley Manville, 1984, King Charles III, Oresteia, Uncle Vanya. B Mike Bartlett, Richard Eyre, Robert Icke, Sacha Wares The crisis will be financial but it is the failure to woo the best artists and produce truly exciting work that makes the Norris NT so far, for me at least, a failure. One thing's for sure, diatribes against the the AD of both the National Theatre and the RSC is a way to get yourself noticed on a messageboard. This is, after all, a place where people arrive to share their love of what they have seen and any nitpicking usually emerges out of that rather than their blazing straight in with such an agenda. Primarily, the mindset of anyone with opinions about the arts is best served by remembering one thing - 'this is not all about you', or maybe more accurately - 'okay, this is all about you, but it's you that are the variable, not the people/organisation that you are trying to claim are the problem'. A little housekeeping - A People. Places and Things, Cleansed, The Flick, Ma Rainey's Black Bottom, Amadeus, Hedda Gabler, Angels in America, Follies. B Katie Mitchell, Marianne Elliot, David Hare, Ivo Van Hove, Robert Icke, Duncan MacMillan, Caryl Churchill (It really is too early, given scheduling, but these are where we are now, as opposed to not needing a crystal ball for Hytner) (As for these - Jerry Springer The Opera (okay but more for shock value), History Boys (tick), Dark Matrrials (breakneck adaptation which did not serve the novels well, although staging was excellent), Elmina's Kitchen (gave Kwei Armah a leg up but hardly earth shattering), The Pillowman (good play, why didn't he go back to the NT?), Complicite Measure for Measure (not Complicite's best and blown out of the water by Hill Gibbins' brilliant Young Vic version), Stuff Happens (really? Dull, dull, dull, not even convincingly acted with wobbly impressions abounding) There are a multitude of theatres in London, across the country, across the world and they each appeal to different people because they are run by different people. As such, you see that the ebb and flow of an organisation is mostly about the opinion of individual patrons and how much they chime or differ with that person/organisation. So it's purely personal opinion and where and how it chimes. I've been to the Donmar so few times recently as it's just not for me. Then again I've been to the Royal Court way more since Cooke left. Others may well feel the opposite, so just go to where you want and, some time, that will change. Just leave it a few years and everything is different again. For the record, you appear to like Goold/Icke, the way that British theatre has adapted to the European director led approach. People who know me here may recall that I am similarly a fan of that theatre. In the end it's not for everyone though, other people deserve their tastes to be reflected as well, it really is not all about me. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 25, 2017 6:37:47 GMT
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Post by Jan on Sept 25, 2017 6:46:49 GMT
Yes -- or to phrase the problem another way, he's now coming up three years in (started March 2015) A What are the huge, industry-shaking successes? B Who are the major defining artists whose home is his regime at that building? To give you two comparisons on the same time scale Hytner started April 2003. So by October 2005 A Jerry Springer The Opera, History Boys, Dark Matrrials, Elmina's Kitchen, The Pillowman, Complicite Measure for Measure, Stuff Happens B Katie Mitchell, Marianne Elliot, David Hare, Simon McBurney, Howard Davies, Kwame Kwei-Armah, Alan Bennett Goold started at the Almieda October 2013. So by May 2016 A Chimerica, Ghosts with Lesley Manville, 1984, King Charles III, Oresteia, Uncle Vanya. B Mike Bartlett, Richard Eyre, Robert Icke, Sacha Wares The crisis will be financial but it is the failure to woo the best artists and produce truly exciting work that makes the Norris NT so far, for me at least, a failure. One thing's for sure, diatribes against the the AD of both the National Theatre and the RSC is a way to get yourself noticed on a messageboard. This is, after all, a place where people arrive to share their love of what they have seen and any nitpicking usually emerges out of that rather than their blazing straight in with such an agenda. Primarily, the mindset of anyone with opinions about the arts is best served by remembering one thing - 'this is not all about you', or maybe more accurately - 'okay, this is all about you, but it's you that are the variable, not the people/organisation that you are trying to claim are the problem'. The problem is that Norris is running the NT as if it IS all about himself - he's programming only things that appeal to him and people like him. Before he took the job he announced that he wasn't familiar with the classical repertoire and that he much preferred the writer of a play to be in the rehearsal room. Result: He doesn't programme anything from the classical repertoire other than a few very familiar plays and he programmes a large number of new plays. It is also clear he is in thrall to the USA so there's a disproportionate number of plays and star actors from there. We know, however, that Hytner programmed plays that he personally disliked to get a more diverse and inclusive repertoire - that made him a better AD than Norris in my view. I think Norris' programming is very self-centred in a way only Nunn's was before - whether it is justified by having the same financial success of the latter we'll see. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 25, 2017 7:34:18 GMT
It's almost amusing how some people seem to want the NT to appeal to their personal taste while also crowing on about some kind of mythical national appeal or service.
Cardinal Pirelli hits the nail on the head above- theatres with their ADs have a sort of ebb and flow. I too have barely darkened the door of the Donmar in recent years whereas I used to be there a lot. It's not that the stuff programmed is terrible- it's just for me it's fallen off the 'unmissable' radar on the whole. Meanwhile, for me the Almeida is now ticking a lot of boxes, but come their next round of announcements that may change again. Similarly while I went to the NT a lot under Hytner there were also seasons where I didn't set foot there. All of this because personally there was nothing of a 'must see'.
The idea of there somehow being a 'correct' set of programming because it's the 'National Theatre' is also getting a bit ridiculous. How can anyone define what is right for 'the nation' anyway?
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Post by zahidf on Sept 25, 2017 7:49:09 GMT
It's almost amusing how some people seem to want the NT to appeal to their personal taste while also crowing on about some kind of mythical national appeal or service. Cardinal Pirelli hits the nail on the head above- theatres with their ADs have a sort of ebb and flow. I too have barely darkened the door of the Donmar in recent years whereas I used to be there a lot. It's not that the stuff programmed is terrible- it's just for me it's fallen off the 'unmissable' radar on the whole. Meanwhile, for me the Almeida is now ticking a lot of boxes, but come their next round of announcements that may change again. Similarly while I went to the NT a lot under Hytner there were also seasons where I didn't set foot there. All of this because personally there was nothing of a 'must see'. The idea of there somehow being a 'correct' set of programming because it's the 'National Theatre' is also getting a bit ridiculous. How can anyone define what is right for 'the nation' anyway? Yeah, this. Most theatre have hits or misses, I don't think the national is particularly different to that, under Hytner or now. Hytner had some TERRIBLE shows in the main theatres as well. Dance of Death and Greenfield come to mind immediately. |
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