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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2017 23:43:58 GMT
That
Rufus Norris
Directed
Festen and Market Boy
2 of my all time favourite plays and stagings
What has happened to him??!!??!!??!!
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Post by dlevi on Jul 29, 2017 9:14:40 GMT
I think he's a better director than a producer or administrator. Some people can run buildings and maintain an artistic high standard ( Hytner, Grandage, Kent, Mendes, Daniel Evans) but some can't. It's a difficult balancing act. I think he's in over his head and as an artist he doesn't know how to say no to his colleagues when he should ( Salome, Common, Wonderland) . It's a hard job and I just think he's in over his head.
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Post by lynette on Jul 29, 2017 22:38:56 GMT
He doesn't have to collect the rubbish and change the light bulbs. I thought the executive director did all the building management. So surely all..and I'm being devilishly provocative here...ALL he has to do is get a few people together to work out a nice programme of work to put on. And he can choose something for himself to direct.
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Post by Jan on Jul 30, 2017 8:16:38 GMT
He's not a showman. (No eye for the simple crowd pleaser. He's revived Amadeus but I bet he wouldn't have staged it originally). Previous NT directors were (except Eyre maybe). He was wrong for the job, he should have taken over the Almeida and Goold should have got the NT. Norris only programs stuff that people like himself like, the others (and Hytner admitted it) programmed stuff that they personally disliked but others liked. As a result the NT is less diverse in its programming - I've virtually stopped going and I am in a sizeable (and affluent) section of the potential audience - just chucking me one Shakespeare a year from the most frequently performed list isn't good enough.
One good point above - we know for a fact that on occasion Hall, Nunn, Eyre and Hytner either killed a dud production prior to opening or went in and virtually took it over themselves. I wonder if Norris is maybe just too nice to do that and has let the recent series of flops go on unchanged.
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Post by lynette on Jul 30, 2017 9:45:34 GMT
I suppose we are going to be offered a string of 'relevant ' new writing . I think you are right Jan about the previous guys offering stuff they didn't necessarily like themselves.
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Post by lynette on Jul 30, 2017 9:46:58 GMT
If nobody else joins this thread I might change the title to Old Grumps' symposium.
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Post by Jan on Jul 30, 2017 10:08:26 GMT
That was a criticism of Nunn too, he ran the place virtually single-handed with a huge number of his own productions - but with the confidence and experience to do that that I think Norris lacks.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2017 10:38:35 GMT
If nobody else joins this thread I might change the title to Old Grumps' symposium. Ha! I too find myself going far less than I used to and I could (and will) bore for hours about the rising prices. However I won't reduce the old or grumpy quotient I'm afraid. |
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Post by Jan on Jul 30, 2017 13:20:48 GMT
If nobody else joins this thread I might change the title to Old Grumps' symposium. Norris does seem to have alienated quite a wide range of theatregoers though. Our chum HG has tastes almost diametrically opposed to me and yet he too disapproves of Norris (for his fixation with all things American in his case). On the point above about him disliking other talented people, I hadn't thought of that - I'd been too busy making exactly that case against Greg Doran. |
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Post by lynette on Jul 30, 2017 13:28:38 GMT
I've ranted about the NT on many occasions. Not heard about Norris being afraid of the talent before. I guess it is difficult to work there for many reasons.
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Post by Jan on Jul 30, 2017 13:38:20 GMT
I've ranted about the NT on many occasions. Not heard about Norris being afraid of the talent before. I guess it is difficult to work there for many reasons. Yes. Nunn was a one-man show not entirely through choice, he offered associate director status to lots of directors and they all turned him down, many didn't like the two big stages. That's why if you have someone good like Howard Davies who actually likes working there you should keep them. When does Norris' contract end ? |
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Post by samuelwhiskers on Jul 30, 2017 14:22:30 GMT
Meanwhile Simon Godwin is lurking, Nomi Malone-style, at the top of the big NT staircase.
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Post by Jan on Jul 30, 2017 14:40:25 GMT
Meanwhile Simon Godwin is lurking, Nomi Malone-style, at the top of the big NT staircase. Think he'd need to self-identify as a woman to get the gig. |
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Post by martin1965 on Jul 30, 2017 15:36:00 GMT
I've ranted about the NT on many occasions. Not heard about Norris being afraid of the talent before. I guess it is difficult to work there for many reasons. Yes. Nunn was a one-man show not entirely through choice, he offered associate director status to lots of directors and they all turned him down, many didn't like the two big stages. That's why if you have someone good like Howard Davies who actually likes working there you should keep them. When does Norris' contract end ? They seem to be five years so that would be 2020. He needs a huge 2018. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2017 15:48:59 GMT
While I do agree with many of these criticisms, to be fair it should be pointed out that:
Angels in America - entire run sold out
Mosquitoes - entire run sold out
Oslo - entire run sold out
Follies - initial booking period pretty much sold out
Network - All shows up to January sold out
The Majority - most performances sold out
So yes, there have been some duds including a couple of recent high profile ones, but that was the case under previous regimes (eg Damned by Despair). I appreciate not all of the above originated at the NT and some pre-date Norris, but this isn't a failing organisation.
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Post by Jan on Jul 30, 2017 16:07:47 GMT
While I do agree with many of these criticisms, to be fair it should be pointed out that: Angels in America - entire run sold out Mosquitoes - entire run sold out Oslo - entire run sold out Follies - initial booking period pretty much sold out Network - All shows up to January sold out The Majority - most performances sold out So yes, there have been some duds including a couple of recent high profile ones, but that was the case under previous regimes (eg Damned by Despair). I appreciate not all of the above originated at the NT and some pre-date Norris, but this isn't a failing organisation. The finances of this organisation mean that having two flops in the Olivier at the same time makes it a failing organisation, the finances are finely balanced. Also their somewhat generous returns policy means that a show that sells-out pre-opening may not in fact sell out after the reviews come in. I wonder what deal Disney have given them for Pinnochio ? That should be a money-spinner but I wonder how much the NT get from subsequent transfers. |
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Post by Jan on Jul 30, 2017 16:07:58 GMT
While I do agree with many of these criticisms, to be fair it should be pointed out that: Angels in America - entire run sold out Mosquitoes - entire run sold out Oslo - entire run sold out Follies - initial booking period pretty much sold out Network - All shows up to January sold out The Majority - most performances sold out So yes, there have been some duds including a couple of recent high profile ones, but that was the case under previous regimes (eg Damned by Despair). I appreciate not all of the above originated at the NT and some pre-date Norris, but this isn't a failing organisation. The finances of this organisation mean that having two flops in the Olivier at the same time makes it a failing organisation, the finances are finely balanced. Also their somewhat generous returns policy means that a show that sells-out pre-opening may not in fact sell out after the reviews come in. I wonder what deal Disney have given them for Pinnochio ? That should be a money-spinner but I wonder how much the NT get from subsequent transfers. |
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Post by martin1965 on Jul 30, 2017 18:30:02 GMT
While I do agree with many of these criticisms, to be fair it should be pointed out that: Angels in America - entire run sold out Mosquitoes - entire run sold out Oslo - entire run sold out Follies - initial booking period pretty much sold out Network - All shows up to January sold out The Majority - most performances sold out So yes, there have been some duds including a couple of recent high profile ones, but that was the case under previous regimes (eg Damned by Despair). I appreciate not all of the above originated at the NT and some pre-date Norris, but this isn't a failing organisation. The finances of this organisation mean that having two flops in the Olivier at the same time makes it a failing organisation, the finances are finely balanced. Also their somewhat generous returns policy means that a show that sells-out pre-opening may not in fact sell out after the reviews come in. I wonder what deal Disney have given them for Pinnochio ? That should be a money-spinner but I wonder how much the NT get from subsequent transfers. Ive been wondering about the Disney deal, if it goes well (im not going) then surely a transfer over to the US is on the cards? Network is clearly primed for Broadway, the remainder of the casting will show for sure. Im going to Oslo but the whole scheduling of a three week pre west end run is very odd! |
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Post by bordeaux on Jul 30, 2017 20:57:28 GMT
I also have a theory that he doesn't like other talented people. Hall had the best set of associates imaginable for that time: Pinter, Jonathan Miller, Blakemore etc. Eyre brought in Deborah Warner and McBurney and LePage, as well as making Hytner his associate (among others). Norris lost the much respected Tessa Ross in weeks, rumoured to be because he wouldn't let her be involved in matters artistic, where she is undeniably gifted if you look at her film work. No associate appointments with any ability to get work onto the main stages. And all the talent is elsewhere. His director associates should be feeding that building and they aren't, but then they aren't the right picks. Dominic Cooke (brilliant Ma Rainey, nothing since) Nadia Fall (dreary) Simon Godwin (dull) Tom Morris (no shows at all since Norris arrived) Lyndsey Turner (makes her best work at the Donmar and the Almeida) The Court this season had Mitchell, Tiffany, McBurney, Debbie tucker green and Sam Mendes. The Almeida has Icke and Goold on repeat visits, plus Lyndsey turner, Cracknell, Sacha Wares, and Ian Rickson and Richard Jones still to come. Hardly any of the above names have worked at the Norris NT in recent months, and I think, other than Turner doing the new Rory Mullarkey play, they aren't presently lined up to. It isn't that there isn't talent out there at the moment. It's that either Norris doesn't want it in the building or it doesn't want to work with Norris. The smell of panic is a real turn off. Imagine if he made Cracknell and Icke and Sacha Wares associates and they each did a show a year in each of the big theatre's. That's the real problem with the Norris NT. He's threatened by the talent. Come on, there are obviously problems but I don't think he feels hostile to others' talent. There is nothing he'd rather have than a string of hit shows, great plays directed by great directors. Some of the above-mentioned are coming back soon - Cooke for Follies, then there is Ivo van Hove's Network, but these directors are in demand everywhere. There are problems with new writing, with the odd exception, and some surprisingly dull choices of classics for someone who claims to want to shake things up and make them more diverse - Waste, Deep Blue Sea, Beaux' Stratagem, Amadeus (dull choice, but the execution may have been brilliant). I don't think he has a high-enough profile himself as a known director compared to others coming into the job - have people ever said they want to see the new Norris in the way they would go and see something if it was directed by Nunn or Hytner or Eyre. It is reminiscent of the early days of Trevor Nunn where someone pointed out that lots of writers were writing their worst ever play for him. Then came the astonishing year when he did that repertory with SRB and Roger Allam and co. Things change quite quickly, but he is in desperate need of a couple of hits. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2017 21:18:49 GMT
Does seem people are keen to blame Norris for anything that doesn't go well and give Hytner (or anyone else) the credit for anything that does!
To quote David Lan in today's Sunday Times: "If a show goes well it's somebody else's success. If it doesn't go well, it's my failure"
The most recent National Theatre annual report (published Oct 2016) doesn't indicate a company in crisis:
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Post by samuelwhiskers on Jul 30, 2017 22:11:05 GMT
Meanwhile Simon Godwin is lurking, Nomi Malone-style, at the top of the big NT staircase. Think he'd need to self-identify as a woman to get the gig. I reckon Simon's ambitious enough for that, and as anyone who saw the 1991 BBC series "Five Children and It" can attest, he certainly has the acting chops. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2017 23:45:28 GMT
Some Artistic Directors see themselves as more a planner and a leader - they ensure they assemble the right people to do the right jobs and let them get on with it whilst keeping an overall eye on things. Others prefer to be more hands on and lead from the front.
Getting the balance right as to what he or she may direct themselves is always a fine line, too much and it becomes all about them or they overstretch themselves and too little and they are said not to be really doing their job.
At the RSC I've noticed Greg Doran has directed much more than Michael Boyd did in his last couple of years, maybe newer guys lead from the front and when they are settled only do their real passionate projects and hand over other plays to associates or guest directors.
I'd certainly expect an artist director to do at least one and sometimes two shows per season but anything above this could be overkill.
Michelle Terry at the Globe is very much still an actress so may do the program planning and then choose which roles she may take on and bring directors in to run the shows.
The great Olivier I'm sure must have always been pressured to act when NT director given his reputation and the crowds he could draw in.
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Post by tributary on Jul 31, 2017 0:13:49 GMT
I've ranted about the NT on many occasions. Not heard about Norris being afraid of the talent before. I guess it is difficult to work there for many reasons. Yes. Nunn was a one-man show not entirely through choice, he offered associate director status to lots of directors and they all turned him down, many didn't like the two big stages. That's why if you have someone good like Howard Davies who actually likes working there you should keep them. When does Norris' contract end ? Of course it is possible that Norris has invited a better set of associates who have turned him down. Anyone know anything? |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2017 0:19:16 GMT
Nobody knows anything, ill informed speculation is what the internet is for....
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Post by Jan on Jul 31, 2017 6:40:13 GMT
The only NT production I'll be going to see out of everything that has been announced is Macbeth. I think this will be the first thing I've ever seen directed by Norris. So let's see. I would note that the previous two NT productions of it by Hall and Eyre were notable flops so he has nothing to beat.
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