19,659 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Jun 7, 2017 12:22:36 GMT
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Post by crabtree on Jun 7, 2017 12:38:41 GMT
The Royal Exchange can't leave things alone can they? This isn't me getting frustrated by reinvention but they are getting so predictable now.
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1,119 posts
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Post by martin1965 on Jun 7, 2017 12:43:24 GMT
Just saw this, sounds exciting. There was a broadway revival in the 70s with an all black cast, wonder if this is that version. Love the score so will prob go☺
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Post by d'James on Jun 7, 2017 12:46:19 GMT
I didn't like this when I saw it in London and I'm looking for a reason to go to The Royal Exchange, but this isn't it.
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581 posts
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Post by princeton on Jun 7, 2017 13:03:53 GMT
The Royal Exchange can't leave things alone can they? Also just announced: Our Town - "Sarah Frankcom puts Manchester centre stage as she redefines Thorton Wilder’s Pulitzer-Prize winning story of ordinary people for our city today" I know they want to make theatre relevant and it may turn out to be genius - but they do love a bit of a fiddle!! |
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5,138 posts
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Post by TallPaul on Jun 7, 2017 13:08:42 GMT
What era will this be set in? I'm genuinely not sure when Harlem's renaissance was.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2017 13:09:57 GMT
The Royal Exchange can't leave things alone can they? Also just announced: Our Town - "Sarah Frankcom puts Manchester centre stage as she redefines Thorton Wilder’s Pulitzer-Prize winning story of ordinary people for our city today" I know they want to make theatre relevant and it may turn out to be genius - but they do love a bit of a fiddle!! Guess they'll all be starring Maxine Peake! |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2017 13:10:28 GMT
I know they want to make theatre relevant and it may turn out to be genius - but they do love a bit of a fiddle!! Well. Don't we all? |
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5,138 posts
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Post by TallPaul on Jun 7, 2017 13:25:56 GMT
Everyone should visit the Royal Exchange Theatre at least once. I recommend an early start and booking a banquette seat, in person, on the day.
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Post by crabtree on Jun 7, 2017 14:26:33 GMT
It is an amazing venue, and there have been some truly breathtaking productions there, and the theatre gave me my first job, in its' wonderful first season, but recently they have become doggedly determined to be different, often visually ugly, and thumping home messages with not much subtlety, and messages that are more about the director than the play. I'm still scarred from their Into the woods and their idea of Cinderella's mother as a somewhat muscular gender fluid lady hanging upside from a trapeze in army fatigues. I'm fine with innovation, but where is that feel for Mother in the text or music.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2017 18:26:38 GMT
The new season also has a new stage version of Derek Jarman's 1979 film Jubilee, with original star Toyah now to appear as Toyah Wilcox in the role of Queen Elizabeth. Chris Goode's new version will be set in our present, so doubtless all the posters here will start complaining about everything being changed, as they nostalgically reminisce about the good old days when punk was punk and you could all merrily cram into a sweatbox and spit all over each other all night long.
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114 posts
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Post by showbizkid on Jun 7, 2017 22:30:00 GMT
An all black cast?? I think this is a disgrace and PC blind colour casting gone too far. What about an all white cast of The Lion King? Madness... I'm sorry but it has to be said.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2017 22:39:16 GMT
It's a co-production with Talawa, the UK's main black theatre company. The Royal Exchange is very good at co-producing with various smaller national companies, (such as Talawa previously and also Told by an Idiot and Graeae, for example), and enabling those companies to work on a larger scale than usual. All these national companies exist because their constituencies are generally overlooked by the "mainstream" companies. They don't only cast from a limited pool - the whole company exists to support the work of theatremakers from their specific community and to address their specific audiences, as well as the general audience, who are neglected by the "mainstream".
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34 posts
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Post by meso77 on Jun 7, 2017 22:40:49 GMT
It's a coproduction with Talawa. Can't see what the problem is. They've done previous productions at this theatre including All My Sons and King Lear.
edit. HG beat me to it.
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4,955 posts
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Post by Someone in a tree on Jun 8, 2017 6:40:13 GMT
Hopefully it will be better than the recent production in Wendy's End
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185 posts
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Post by boybooshka on Jun 8, 2017 6:53:31 GMT
An all black cast?? I think this is a disgrace and PC blind colour casting gone too far. What about an all white cast of The Lion King? Madness... I'm sorry but it has to be said. No it doesn't, it really doesn't at all. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2017 7:53:45 GMT
Where's the "dislike" button?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2017 13:32:10 GMT
I get what you're getting at Monkey. And I'm equally intrigued but have questions, though I do trust Talawa/Exchange to have thought it through. My instinct is that they want to do it just because it's excellent, and use their existing company, and the co-production is a means for production costs sharing and access to broader audiences. And that's all fab.
Of course there are concerns with how you 'play' it, will it (accidentally or not) end up playing to Stereotypes? or if they try and be 'experimental' with it will that actually work in reverse? it's far too early to say but these are valid things to discuss!
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Post by hereforham on Jun 8, 2017 13:58:27 GMT
Why was it wrong to question an all white cast of The Lion King but okay to consider The Wiz? An "all white" Wiz is The Wizard of Oz, that's the point?
The term is superfluous because "all black" isn't a reference to skin colour it's a reference to a cultural minority. So an "all black" Guys and Dolls wouldn't necessarily be conforming to stereotypes it would just be placing the black culture at that time at the forefront rather than in the background for whatever reason. Hamilton's reason is to showcase current musical trends in an unusual setting to enhance both forms. I'm guessing, haven't seen it, hear it's good.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2017 14:21:43 GMT
This new production is to be relocated to Harlem during its renaissance (which was in the 1920s). So, the casting is the complete opposite of the "colour blind" casting claimed by showbizkid. It will recreate the period quite authentically, I imagine, and detractors may dismiss that as stereotyping but really it's celebrating an explosively creative historical moment. And the ethnicity of all the casting hasn't been announced. Harlem was a melting pot at that time. I think there's some confusion here about a Black-led company. It's not a company which only casts Black actors.
This seems a similar approach to Bijan Sheibani's Almeida relocation of Lorca's House of Bernarda Alba from the original rural Spain to rural Iran, to give just one example.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2017 14:32:09 GMT
Why was it wrong to question an all white cast of The Lion King but okay to consider The Wiz? An "all white" Wiz is The Wizard of Oz, that's the point? The term is superfluous because "all black" isn't a reference to skin colour it's a reference to a cultural minority. So an "all black" Guys and Dolls wouldn't necessarily be conforming to stereotypes it would just be placing the black culture at that time at the forefront rather than in the background for whatever reason. Hamilton's reason is to showcase current musical trends in an unusual setting to enhance both forms. I'm guessing, haven't seen it, hear it's good. In answer to your opening question, it's very much about the tone of the questioners.  If someone genuinely wants to know why, as an unrelated example, Gay Pride exists, then I'd be happy to talk it through with them. If however they're asking because they're offended that straight pride isn't a thing, I'm not going to engage, because (and I know some will find this hard to believe) I don't particularly like arguing with belligerent people who just want to have a barney. Genuine curiosity will always lead to better - and less aggressive - conversations than people spewing about "POLITICAL CORRECTNESS GONE MAD". |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2017 14:38:36 GMT
Also see how Monkey phrased questions for discussion, that are genuine and contribute to the broader discussion, and mine and HG's response vs, as Baemax says the tone of 'BUT WHY IS THIS OK' that's not really looking for an answer...
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19,659 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Jun 8, 2017 15:41:50 GMT
This new production is to be relocated to Harlem during its renaissance (which was in the 1920s). OK, now THAT is exciting indeed. A whole new spin on the tale. Want to see this for sure. Ooh have you been oop north before monkey? If you come early I could introduce you to my whippet and my pigeons and thenwe could have a pie on a bap for us dinner before t'afternoon show! |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2017 16:22:06 GMT
BurlyBeaR that sounds like a party we ALL want inviting too.
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Post by hereforham on Jun 8, 2017 16:22:09 GMT
No, it actually isn't. "The Wiz" is a show in itself, created as a deliberately contrasting cultural experience. To change the ethnicity of the cast would be a major issue. If they left the show intact with a white cast, the result could be a horrible "Minstrel Show" type situation. If they change it totally, it would probably cause the piece to fall to pieces. The directorial vision would have to be as strong as the one they will take with "Guys and Dolls" in order to bring off something that does what any production should - find something fresh in a text - without any tinge of ethnic origin conflict. I'm guessing, haven't seen it, hear it's bad but is it not a response to the whiteness of the original story using the only black cultural stereotypes that were available and acceptable at that time? A white cast would be insensitive because 70's portrayals themselves have moved on and become negative stereotypes or is the original self aware? A black cast in white face playing white actors playing black actors would work in that scenario right? |
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If someone genuinely wants to know why, as an unrelated example, Gay Pride exists, then I'd be happy to talk it through with them. If however they're asking because they're offended that straight pride isn't a thing, I'm not going to engage, because (and I know some will find this hard to believe) I don't particularly like arguing with belligerent people who just want to have a barney. Genuine curiosity will always lead to better - and less aggressive - conversations than people spewing about "POLITICAL CORRECTNESS GONE MAD".
