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Post by ceebee on Sept 14, 2024 13:18:10 GMT
I probably won't see this show but it is mildly amusing just walking by to see how the "ick" in the Garrick theatre lettering has been turned a glittery pink.
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Post by max on Sept 14, 2024 14:47:39 GMT
I probably won't see this show but it is mildly amusing just walking by to see how the "ick" in the Garrick theatre lettering has been turned a glittery pink. Haha, is this more self referential social media awareness from this show, or just a quirk of the marquee lighting? I've come to realise I want more "ick" in theatre. The word is usually doled out on YouTube theatre channels where the "ick" means they've seen a behaviour portrayed that they don't want to allow or understand exists, however awkward and humanly real. Yet these 'ick police' are usually from a group (sexuality or gender identity) that was the mainstream "ick" for decades. How is that lost on them? They put the ick in critic. ; ) |
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Post by ceebee on Sept 14, 2024 14:53:14 GMT
The 'ick' looks like brand new lettering on both sides of the canopy.
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Post by PineappleForYou on Sept 14, 2024 16:37:23 GMT
I probably won't see this show but it is mildly amusing just walking by to see how the "ick" in the Garrick theatre lettering has been turned a glittery pink. Haha, is this more self referential social media awareness from this show, or just a quirk of the marquee lighting? I've come to realise I want more "ick" in theatre. The word is usually doled out on YouTube theatre channels where the "ick" means they've seen a behaviour portrayed that they don't want to allow or understand exists, however awkward and humanly real. Yet these 'ick police' are usually from a group (sexuality or gender identity) that was the mainstream "ick" for decades. How is that lost on them? They put the ick in critic. ; ) "The ick" is more just that you find something a "turn off" or not to your personal liking. It's not about cancelling that thing. The word is just the way young adults express the things they don't really vibe with personally. |
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Post by ladidah on Sept 14, 2024 16:41:58 GMT
Yes, ick is way more casual than that. A little quirk or habit that turns you off.
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Post by PineappleForYou on Sept 14, 2024 22:05:27 GMT
I saw this tonight and I agree with most that has been said by others on the thread. This is a long ramble, sorry.
To show my cards, I am a member of Gen Z and this is totally made for my generation. It's certainly aimed for the original Six fans that have now grown up and are exploring the world of dating themselves. Problem is, this audience just doesn't exist in the West End and this show is very specific to that audience. The Bee song is an example of that. It's tailored to Gen Z's irrelevant humour and slight ADHD tendencies. I don't get me wrong, this show could work great and be very successful, but off West End. It doesn't leave much for the 50+ and the tourists which is the main West End audience. This wasn't a problem for Six as it had word of mouth going into its run but just the creators names aren't strong enough to guarantee success here in a bigger house.
With my theatre hat on, this show left me the same question that Opening Night did (even though they are polar opposites on paper). That is: why did no one say that this has big issues earlier on in the process?
Do producers not understand young people that much that they let the creators of Six do their own thing because, after all, they created Six? Do the creators of Six think they are beyond fringe theatre after their global phenomenon (even though it would have drastically tightened up their new show and created a solid fanbase)? Did the creators of Six believe that unless they got a new show in the West End now they would fade into obscurity and so scrabbled together the most tenuous ideas for a show without a plot (as the show itself suggests with the character of the theatre agent)?
This could be a simple one act fringe show about two friends working out their relationship woes with catchy tunes and wine. Instead it's a overindulgent splat of stuff and needlessly meta to its disadvantage.
Remove the writing a musical part as it drags the show down. We don't care about it, we are never made to care about it. The show suffers from a terrible case of tell not show. Show me the consequence of not writing the show. Show me why she shouldn't go back with the ex. Show me the experiences that have led to insecurities surrounding gender and dating. But instead here's a man dressed as a fridge.
The cast is great, the score is pretty good and band plays it well. And there was a lot of decent material in here but I wish it was all decent material.
I just can't get away from the fact that they were handed a blank cheque in the Garrick to parachute this half-baked show in when there are so many other new refined musicals gagging for a West End space.
It's a 3* from me.
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Post by unseaworthy on Sept 14, 2024 22:26:49 GMT
I wonder if the timing is a problem too, now the teenagers are all back to school, it might be harder to build an audience.
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Post by showgirl on Sept 15, 2024 4:09:01 GMT
All this jargon (eg "ick", "Gen Z" etc) does make it hard for those unfamiliar with the terms to understand the posts. Things were easier when people simply said "20-somethings" - or whichever age group they did mean. I was interested in seeing this and still am but I'm not going to Google multiple terms to find out what they mean before reading posts. As for original fans of Six having grown up, I am one of those & in my mid-60s, so would like to think that I was already as grown up as I'll ever be when I saw it. Still seeing very positive professional reviews so the difference between those and the opinions of the paying public are puzzling.
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Post by singingbird on Sept 15, 2024 7:18:33 GMT
I saw this tonight and I agree with most that has been said by others on the thread. This is a long ramble, sorry. This post is a really spot on analysis, I think. I've not seen the show but must admit I'm curious. I have always tried to see the more niche musicals and this may be one that becomes the stuff of legend! But it feels like a bad case of "difficult second album" syndrome. It can't have been easy knowing what to do after writing Six. |
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Post by max on Sept 15, 2024 7:58:58 GMT
All this jargon (eg "ick", "Gen Z" etc) does make it hard for those unfamiliar with the terms to understand the posts. Things were easier when people simply said "20-somethings" - or whichever age group they did mean. I was interested in seeing this and still am but I'm not going to Google multiple terms to find out what they mean before reading posts. As for original fans of Six having grown up, I am one of those & in my mid-60s, so would like to think that I was already as grown up as I'll ever be when I saw it. Still seeing very positive professional reviews so the difference between those and the opinions of the paying public are puzzling. I guess the production noticing they could highlight the 'ick' in 'Garrick Theatre' (as noticed by ceebee on the theatre facade) sends a nod of recognition to the bullseye audience. A kind of IYKYK identifier ('If You Know, You Know'), like gay polari or the more obscure bits of rhyming slang. Funny thing is that it doesn't exclude anybody who thinks they've just made the end of the word nicely colourful - UNTIL they find out it's a knowing sign. Then it's either delight at what they've done, or dread that it may be a painfully 'in' thing for a certain club of people. It feels to me a new thing, this 'clubbable' marketing style - picking up from 'Operation Mincemeat' cultivating audience as early adopters (the fringe versions) and then as repeat-viewing Agents and co-opted advocates for the West End (on not-that-generous money off rewards). It turned me right off 'Mincemeat' - until I saw and admired the show (twice). On jargon - definitions of 'ick' vary a fair bit (particularly in how condemning it is/isn't in usage); but I appreciate posters here who refined what I'd assumed. |
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Post by max on Sept 15, 2024 8:11:56 GMT
It will be interesting if the show survives on the postive professional reviews or the bloggers/influencers?I have a feeling the latter appeals to its target audience more. Definitely; though even a middling Mainstream Press review (Time Out, 3 stars) talked about it being crammed with memorable tunes - and that goes a long way for all audiences. The Times (4 stars) also used that C word "The frustration is that meandering as the whole is, the songs are largely great. So many modern musicals are decent enough as stage plays but can’t muster a single memorable tune. ‘Why Am I So Single?’ is crammed with them". |
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Post by thedriftersgirl on Sept 15, 2024 10:53:09 GMT
I probably won't see this show but it is mildly amusing just walking by to see how the "ick" in the Garrick theatre lettering has been turned a glittery pink. Where is this new lettering? I must’ve missed it when I looked up at the Garrick yesterday. |
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Post by PineappleForYou on Sept 15, 2024 10:55:49 GMT
It will be interesting if the show survives on the postive professional reviews or the bloggers/influencers?I have a feeling the latter appeals to its target audience more. This is true but I think "Why am I so single" has a target audience in their 20s that generally doesn't have the money to keep going to the West End if they don't live near by. I think "Six" works because that is aimed at a teenage audience whose parents often accompany them and buy the tickets. I would say last night's performance was just over 2/3 full in the Stalls with a large chunk missing in the middle. That isn't great for an open-ended run. It will totally rely on word-of-mouth, which again, they could have got a head start on by opening off West End. |
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Post by normasturban on Sept 15, 2024 11:08:23 GMT
Quite agree that the decision to rush this to the West End will be its undoing. There is something strong here but needed a lot more workshopping.
I don’t blame Marlow and Moss for that either. Judging by the interview with the producer, it sounds like the producers were quite happy to rush it in rather than give it a try-out.
Fair play to the pair of them for going for something so… low key for a second show. If I had a phenomenon like Six behind and I was handed a blank cheque for my follow up, you better believe I’d have given you something ridiculous and rich.
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Post by oxfordsimon on Sept 15, 2024 11:22:09 GMT
I do blame them for pushing ahead without an external director.
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Post by PineappleForYou on Sept 15, 2024 12:13:31 GMT
I do blame them for pushing ahead without an external director. Or a book writer. |
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Post by ceebee on Sept 15, 2024 12:31:58 GMT
I probably won't see this show but it is mildly amusing just walking by to see how the "ick" in the Garrick theatre lettering has been turned a glittery pink. Where is this new lettering? I must’ve missed it when I looked up at the Garrick yesterday. On the sides of the main canopy - I was walking up to the Wyndhams and noticed it. |
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Post by thedriftersgirl on Sept 15, 2024 13:00:21 GMT
Where is this new lettering? I must’ve missed it when I looked up at the Garrick yesterday. On the sides of the main canopy - I was walking up to the Wyndhams and noticed it. Ah makes sense as I was facing straight on from the other side of the road rather than facing towards the Wyndhams. Shall keep an eye out next time! |
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Post by PineappleForYou on Sept 15, 2024 14:23:25 GMT
I probably won't see this show but it is mildly amusing just walking by to see how the "ick" in the Garrick theatre lettering has been turned a glittery pink. Where is this new lettering? I must’ve missed it when I looked up at the Garrick yesterday. Here you are:   |
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Post by Jon on Sept 15, 2024 16:24:31 GMT
One of the things Operation Mincemeat did once it came to the West End was have an experienced director in Rob Hastie direct it. It's interesting that Spitlip were willing to let the show to be handed over to someone else and help shape it to the show it is now whereas Marlow and Moss perhaps thought they didn't need anyone else aside from themselves to craft their new show.
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Post by greatauntedna on Sept 15, 2024 17:02:43 GMT
I don’t think they’re full of themselves. Maybe it just didn’t pan out perfectly.
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Post by max on Sept 15, 2024 17:10:03 GMT
Agreeing with the comment from @pineappleforyou :
"It will totally rely on word-of-mouth, which again, they could have got a head start on by opening off West End."
Even if a show doesn't technically need to start fringe or off West End in order to exist, the benefit of fervent early adopters who become advocates is so huge. Some shows feel built for that approach. It's a bit like record companies wanting the cache of their artist starting viral - whether true or a touch engineered to appear that way
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Post by unseaworthy on Sept 15, 2024 20:55:48 GMT
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Post by greatauntedna on Sept 15, 2024 21:29:57 GMT
Just seen it a second time, excellent! The only thing I’d say is the build up to Disco Ball is scrappy.
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Post by esteveyb on Sept 16, 2024 11:12:41 GMT
Just seen it a second time, excellent! The only thing I’d say is the build up to Disco Ball is scrappy. I agree, it needs a definitive start - whereas the intro is underscored by the previous song. I saw it again for the third time on gala night, and I've actually decided that it's not necessarily for Gen Z after all. Particularly in light of some of the so-called younger "influencers" who haven't enjoyed it, there are actually far too many references for it to be for them. It's actually for millennials, like Lucy and Toby themselves - both were born in 1994. They were 6 in 2000 (when the music that is referenced in S N O G G E D was popular) - and approaching secondary school when the mid-00s emo-pop-rock was huge (Green Day, My Chemical Romance, etc.) between 2004-2008. Friends would have been culturally significant for them, especially when it ended in 2004. There's Something About Miriam aired the same year. Gen Z are defined as having been born between 1997 – 2012. Someone born in 2008-2012 is probably not going to get any of the show's main references. And actually, this is also reflected in the attitude towards being single in the show - studies have reported a change in marital perceptions between Gen Z and millennials, arguably for the former there's less pressure on being in a relationship thanks to millennials bucking previous trends. |
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